Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Okies just pm and iff i can help i will.

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Welcome mma2000. I love the ufc too, if that's what your nick's about; if not, forget it. Anyhow, like charlie said, there'll be fliers to go after new year, and maybe some different ones later on. Not much point of actual raids on the org lately, as it's nearly always closed. Sunderland cell used to be more active on WWP, and have more people raeping it in the past, but this seems to have wained (on this site) as the activity of the org has wained. It's not exactly Clearwater, but there's always still stuff to do. The org is from all outward appearances, on it's knees, and there is a proposed Ideal Org in Gateshead. Good to hear from another local voice. Check out the sites info and resources, be yourself, and get involved, be it online, or IRL. Enjoy

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Thanks man and yep you guessed correct; MMA = Mixed Martial Arts

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

On page 42 / 214 of:

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/45807/response/131692/attach/2/Section A i.pdf

"With Scientology however it is unneccesary to look for such intangible indirect benefit to the public. This is because all of the services of Scientology are directly concerned with delivering benefits to the public at large."

I noticed that this paragraph was circled by somebody in the local authority. I am guessing that this statement must have helped in some way to get them rates relief in Sunderland. But even if you read one of their official sites describing auditing you can see that the statement is at best highly misleading.

http://www.auditing.org/

It looks to me that it is all about increasing personal ability rather than being "directly concerned with delivering benefits to the public at large". Maybe my interpretation is somehow biased and I am interpreting it way too narrowly. What do other people think?

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Bottom of page 99 / 124 of the above document:

"The German Courts have recognized Scientology as a religion in many case. For example, in November 1997, the German Federal Supreme Administrative Court issued a ruling that the services of Scientology are spiritual in nature and do not have a commercial basis."

O RLY?

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/45807/response/131703/attach/2/Section A ii.pdf

On page 41 / 140 :

"3. According to the Church's records 3,108 non-member visitors visited the Fawcett Street Centre and received one or more free services in the last year."

Also take a look at page 43.

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

That even less believable than the german crap .

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

I've been reading the clam solicitor legal arguments for treating Scientology equally to other religions in that they too should have a tax-exempt church in which to worship and this got me wondering whether Satanism would get the same tax advantages if they applied. After all, Lucifer was one of the main angels and is the bringer of light so worshipping Lucifer is akin to worshipping God directly. All they are missing is to lie and claim they are doing good work in the community. What would they call their equivalent of the Volunteer Ministers? Hell's Angels? No, somebody else owns that name but then don't the Hell's Angels do some charity work? Should they be given charitable rates relief on whatever they call their meeting places?

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

L. Ron Hubbard's secret plan to take over the town of Clearwater. Does anyone know where I can get details of this plan as an example of the good work they do in the community?

Edit: Never mind. This looks good enough:

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Library/Shelf/wakefield/us-13.html

Edit2: If you live in the area and you don't like this "Church" getting rates relief then write to your own MP about it:

http://findyourmp.parliament.uk/

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Final Report to the Clearwater Commission‏

From: Roland Rashleigh-Berry (rolandberry@hotmail.com)
Sent: 02 January 2011 17:03:13
To: business.rates@sunderland.gov.uk


Dear Sirs,

I have been reviewing the documentation supplied by the solicitor acting for the Church of Scientology Religious Education College Inc (COSRECI) that you kindly supplied to Mr Thackeray as a result of his FOI request and have been impressed with its content. I think that I too would have granted them discretionary rates relief if I had actually believed even a tenth of what was supplied. However, being an ex-member myself and knowing the dark side to this organisation, I know that what was supplied is not to be taken at face value.

It must be difficult for you to judge such a strange organisation as outsiders. It can all seem so legitimate, friendly and charitable. But let me assure you from my own experience and many years studying this organisation that you are dealing with a dangerous and vicious organisation whose principal aim is to extract the maximum amount of money from its deluded adherents. Of course, you will see winners in this organisation but if you do further reading then you will realise that there are more losers than winners.

By granting them charitable (this will be the subject of another email from me) and discretionary rates relief you have lent this organisation credibility which they will use to the full to draw in new members to extract the maximum possible money from them and to enslave lives. This money they will receive for supposedly charitable purposes will be mostly be sent overseas to the US through the system of shell corporations they use such that COSRECI will never make much of a profit from year to year.

I can give you much more information on any of the points I have made above. At this stage I want to leave you with one single document that described the attempted takeover of the city of Clearwater. It is appropriate as it seems to me that they have started this process in Sunderland. After you have read it you will have a much clearer idea of the nature of this organisation.

Final Report to the Clearwater Commission

Roland Rashleigh-Berry

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

^^^^

I'm floating after writing that.

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Good one Roland .

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Do you think it's worth a Cease and Desist?

I feel it's a New Year and I've lost none of my Suppressive edge. )

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

It's such a good document. Shocking, in fact. It's got it all in. And the misuse of charitable funds which is absolutely perfect.

Just think if it could reverse the decision. And if done once then act as the catalyst to reverse all of it in the UK. )

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Library/guidance/lawpb1208.pdf

Take a look at 4.13

Edit: Can someone please copy the text of 4.13 and post it here?

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

4.13

Intra-vires activities of probative value on the question of whether the main purpose for which an organisation is formed is charitable or non-charitable may be admitted because "(t)he skill of Chancery draftsmen is well able to produce a constitution of charitable flavour to allow the pursuit of aims of a non-charitable or dubiously charitable flavour. In a case where the real purpose for which an organisation is formed is in doubt, it may be legitimate to take into account the nature of the activities of the organisation since its formation carried on". In the same case Scott J also said "... the question whether (the institution) is or is not charitable must, in my view, be answered by reference, to the content of its constitution, construed and assessed in the context of the factual background to its formation..." (including post-formation intra-vires activities of probative value). Ultra vires activities are entirely irrelevant. We can consider where expressed purposes will lead and the consequences of their pursuit.

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Thanks

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Religious Cloaking of Scientology‏

From: Roland Rashleigh-Berry (rolandberry@hotmail.com)
Sent: 06 January 2011 19:42:58
To: Steele Stewart (xxxxxxxxxxxxx@sunderland.gov.uk)


Hi Steele,

I would like people to read about the religious cloaking of Scientology written by Lawrence Brennan. This is the situation you have with Scientology. You have it legally set up as a religion and using correct wording on their Articles of Association to make it look to all the world like a charity but with its real purpose being to extract the maximum money out of people using psuedo-scientific techniques to supposedly increase personal ability. You can tell this from the absurdly high prices being charged for their "auditing". People hope to gain supernormal powers doing their "OT levels". To do the entire Bridge to Total Freedom costs about $350,000 and of course, nobody gets any OT powers.

Religious Cloaking of Scientology | www.scientology-cult.com

Charitable work in the community is all part of the religious cloaking and charitable guise. Very little charitable work is done and it is done mainly to advertise, to give a good impressionm and to draw in fresh recruits. They hope to draw in rich members and extract the maximum amount of money from them such as happened to Maria Pia Gardini.

This subject is touched upon in the Charity Commission document supplied by the COSRECI solicitor in section 4.13 that can be linked to below and I would like people to read the above document and assess this charity "in the context of the factual background to its formation".

http://www.charity-commission.gov.uk/Library/guidance/lawpb1208.pdf


4.13
Intra-vires activities of probative value on the question of whether the main purpose for which an organisation is formed is charitable or non-charitable may be admitted because "(t)he skill of Chancery draftsmen is well able to produce a constitution of charitable flavour to allow the pursuit of aims of a non-charitable or dubiously charitable flavour. In a case where the real purpose for which an organisation is formed is in doubt, it may be legitimate to take into account the nature of the activities of the organisation since its formation carried on". In the same case Scott J also said "... the question whether (the institution) is or is not charitable must, in my view, be answered by reference, to the content of its constitution, construed and assessed in the context of the factual background to its formation..." (including post-formation intra-vires activities of probative value). Ultra vires activities are entirely irrelevant. We can consider where expressed purposes will lead and the consequences of their pursuit.

I contacted the former staff member about the income of 51 Fawcett Street but he did not hold a finance position so he does not know.

I think you have everything now with the addition of this information so there will be no more from me unless you ask me for further information.

Roland

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

Had to google that .


intra vires - within the legal power or authority or a person or official or body etc
law, jurisprudence - the collection of rules imposed by authority; "civilization presupposes respect for the law"; "the great problem for jurisprudence to allow freedom while enforcing order"

ultra vires - beyond the legal power or authority of a person or official or body etc; "an ultra vires contract"

Re: Sunderland Rates Relief based talk

The main thing is that it is the only reference in case law I could find that suggests that the written aims of a charity might be false and that circumstances surrounding the creation of the constitution may be looked at. This means that this "religious cloaking" article can be considered at the same time as the COSRECI Articles of Association. And if that is done then it might be concluded that COSRECI was not genuinely set up for charitable purposes.

It is a valuable tool to put into the hands of a solicitor and was quite a lucky find. And it was Hodkin who submitted the article. It would be ironic if it sunk them - which it might do. Sunderland City Council have plenty to think about right now.

Edit: The quote came from Attorney-General v. Ross and Others

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&so...Go3PcC&usg=AFQjCNHsntLL2ifKbVRHM7YEFYA-ePPOZA

Scientology Volunteer Ministers‏
From: Roland Rashleigh-Berry (rolandberry@hotmail.com)
Sent: 09 January 2011 09:37:10
To: Steele Stewart (xxxxxxxxxx@sunderland.gov.uk)

Hi Steele,

I have another thing to add. That is regarding the "Volunteer Ministers" which are used by the Church to claim that they deliver benefits to the community. Up until now, I have not found any good critical information about this group. I have still not found any so instead I will use an official Church video (in two parts) to support my claims. And those are that the Volunteer Ministers are primarily a dissemination tool used by the Church to advertise its presence, to introduce people to Scientology and to gain new recruits. And that the actual help given to the community is on balance not beneficial.

The two parts of the video can be linked to below:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qu9tFIUJre0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-XnW1luqC50

At the end of the first part and the beginning of the second part (I think there is some overlap) it is clear that the Volunteer Ministers scheme is being used for dissemination. None of these people get trained and receive recognised qualifications for what they do. There is no First Aid training, there is no recognised training in psychological counselling to help victims suffering psychological distress or trauma. In two places in the video I see the e-meter being demonstrated. This will not be used to help people in the community. It is purely a demonstration of Scientology technology and would only be used in future paid-for auditing actions. "Touch assists" are mentioned in a few places and you see it being used in the video. These are not recognised by the medical community as having any value.

About 5 minutes into the second part the speech turns to the subject of people being suppressed and the "antisocial personality". I feel this is a dangerous topic to raise for people having suffered some trauma or loss and may drive them away from family members or friends who can help them or affect the way they deal with other people in their daily lives. It may drive them into the hands of Scientology if they are at a low point in their lives since they might feel they can not trust the people around them. I have found some of their official web sites that discuss this topic:

http://www.scientologyhandbook.org/SH11_1.HTM
http://www.volunteerministers.org/sites/default/files/booklets/suppression-en.pdf

So again, I will sum up and say that the Volunteer Ministers program is primarily a dissemination tool used by the Church to advertise its presence, to introduce people to Scientology and to gain new recruits and that the actual help given to the community is on balance not beneficial.

Roland

Nice. If not done yet, the audio of VMs during 7/7 would be a nice added touch.

I've given them too much already. They have a huge amount to go through if they get serious about reconsidering this rates relief thing. They will gain enough knowledge to form a fixed and consistent opinion that neither I nor the cult can shake them from. We will have to wait and see what happens.

SHOULD they change their minds and we somehow find out about it then I hope some good person here will use WhatDoTheyKnow to ask for all details of how and why they changed their minds and all communications related to the topic as this could be of immense use to the other local authorities. If we are lucky then they too will change their minds.

I sent it to him .

OK, but please edit your post to add the link so we all know what they have got.

Edit: Was it this?
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio/aod/networks/fivelive/aod.shtml?fivelive/flreport_scientologynew

yes

Hi there Anons. Nothing might come of this but Old Guard gave it a go as you can see!
-----------------------------------
RE: Review Meeting‏
From: Roland Rashleigh-Berry (rolandberry@hotmail.com)
Sent: 10 January 2011 18:46:36
To: Steele Stewart (xxxxxxxxx@sunderland.gov.uk)

Hi Steele,

there are a few more points that I made and I would like to include something I sent to you today which will be the first point:

1) Scientology's War Against Judges

http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/media/am-lawyer-1980.html

Note where Boudin told Judge Hart that the Scientologists were running an illegal campaign against him and asked him to do the decent thing and stand down, because as a result he would be biased. Also, the counsel for Scientology stressing Judge Richey's fear for his life should be enough to recuse him from the case.

This is an interesting and instructive article that shows the unusual thoroughness of Scientology-hired lawyers in representing their client. If something is to be learned from this, in the case of rates relief in Sunderland, it is that a heightened degree of awareness regarding legal representations from the Church of Scientology might be of value in matching such professional thoroughness.

2) The Submission from COSRECI

I noticed a couple of outpoints in the submission from the solicitor representing COSRECI where I will choose to use the phrase "clumsy wording" to describe it. That is that it appeared to be claimed that COSRECI was a South Australian charity. I have provided links that show that COSRECI is not registered as a charity in any country (nor has ever been) and does no business in Australia and does not lodge company paperwork there. All their financial activity is conducted in the UK.

Another example of clumsy wording was in saying that all the services of Scientology were directed for the benefit of the public at large. I sent you the Church's own link about the benefits of auditing and it gives the distinct impression that the activity directly results in personal benefit, rather than public benefit, so any benefit to the public must be indirect, rather than direct.

3) Mandatory vs. Discretionary relief

The Charities Act 2006 contains a very clear and unambiguous definition of a "charity" in that an essential element of this is that the charity be subject to the control of the English courts. Obviously, a South Australian entity (that is not even a registered charity) falls outside this definition. I know expert legal advice was sought on this issue but I don't see why. A simple dictionary would have been enough to clear up any misunderstanding of the wording of the Act if there was any confusion.

4) The Introspection Rundown

I brought up this dangerous practice on two occasions. This is what faces each and every person recruited by the organisation in Sunderland. If a person reaches a point where they question the activities of the Church and write notes to their C/S (Case Supervisor) to that effect then they will be destined for this Rundown. A person is locked in a room until they are compliant. If a person is not compliant then they might suffer dangerous health issues and perhaps even die. There has been one known death connected with this Rundown in the person of Lisa McPherson. Her cause of death is disputed by the Church. I have provided a link to the autopsy photos to help you decide for yourselves, if this issue is in dispute.

5) The Affidavits of Maria Pia Gardini

I meant for these affidavits to serve two purposes. One is to consider whether her description of her own auditing on the OT levels (see "body thetans") fits with your officers expectation of it being "directly for the benefit of the public at large" as claimed for all Scientology services or for it being for personal benefit or indeed something different.

Secondly, for the pressure evident on this lady to donate huge amounts of money to the cause and to consider whether this pressure was reasonable and whether the money was freely given.

6) Religious Cloaking

The article by Larry Brennan is intended to highlight the possibility that the Articles of Association of COSRECI might just have a "charitable flavour" that is a cover for non-charitable activity or for dubious charitable activity. If the circumstances behind the formation of this charity are taken into account then perhaps it will be concluded that the charitable nature of this organisation is open to question.

7) Final Report to the Clearwater Commission

Please note in that report the concern the City had that money donated for charitable purposes was not being put to charitable purposes and was being put to even illegal purposes. I feel there is a parallel with the City of Sunderland.

8) Volunteer Ministers Program

I am happy with it as it stands but I would not want my own opinion to be used but rather for your officers to draw their own conclusion from what is said in the two parts of the video itself by the Church representative. Please come to your own conclusion on whether the Volunteer Ministers Program is primarily for dissemination purposes. I formed my own opinion purely from watching that video and I would ask your officers to do the same as I have done.

9) Price list, Hard Sell Pack and Big League Sales

I have nothing to add

10) Forced or Coerced Abortions

I would just like to stress that this happens in the Sea Org with some frequency and there is pressure to recruit into the Sea Org ongoing at all Scientology churches and Sunderland is no exception. It could be young women from Sunderland that this might happen to. Please do not think of this activity as being remote and unconnected in some way.

11) Other topics

I am happy with the wording of the other topics.

12) Conclusion

In a statement to the Guardian given on 15 October 2010, Eric Pickles said:

"a majority of the public did not want the "controversial organisation" to be given the kind of favourable treatment usually reserved for charities and questioned this use of public money."

I think that sums it up very well. This organisation is perceived by the public as being too controversial to be receiving favourable treatment and I hope, after full and careful consideration, that Sunderland City Council will reverse their decision to grant rates relief to this organisation.

Roland Rashleigh-Berry

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Subject: Review Meeting
Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2011 14:11:14 +0000
From: xxxxxxx@sunderland.gov.uk
To: rolandberry@hotmail.com

Roland, does the attached appear to sum up the areas you want considering?

Steele Stewart
Business Rate Manager
Office of the Chief Executive
Sunderland City Council
Telephone Number 0191 5611xxx
www.sunderland.gov.uk

Hi Steele,

for "aweness" please read "awareness" in point 1)

for "officiers" read "officers" in point 8)

Please edit the changes before passing it on to the rates officers and others.

Roland

Again, Anons, do not assume anything will come of this. I put it best at a 50% chance. This is the text of what I got from Sunderland Council so you can all see what is going on (the "Church" as well as I am happy for them to know about it). Old Guard has done his best in the way he feels is right.
-------------------------------------------
Representations Made by Roland Rashleigh-Berry

Introduction

The reason for this report is to bring together the representations made by Mr Roland Rashleigh-Berry and highlight the issues made.

Since making a number of FOI requests Mr Roland Rashleigh-Berry has been in contact with the Business Rate section. He has advised the Council of a number of issues surrounding the scientologists. Mr Rashleigh-Berry would like these issues to be considered with or in addition to his FOI requests.

Mr Rashleigh-Berry is an ex-member of the organisation and has become a ‘leading light’ in the anti-scientology movement. He is a contributor to ‘xenu.net’ a web site that is set up to provide alternative information about scientology.

Mr Rashleigh-Berry has communicated through a serious of emails which contain links to various web pages/documents/videos. Listed below are the emails received and the bullet points, of course the detail may be in the links:

20/08/10

Public Benefit/Case Law

This email asked if the question of public benefit had been considered with regard to the Charity Commissioners case.

20/08/10

Links to a Guide Relating to the City of London Case

22/08/10

Link to the Charity Commissioners Guidance on Public Benefit

25/08/10

St. Hill Manor, East Grinstead

This email points out that the organisation does not receive relief at their headquarters in Sussex.

25/08/10, 26/08/10, 31/08/10 & 01/09/10

Public Benefit and the Use of the Property

These emails make the point that a property used for ‘auditing’ and training is not used for public benefit. The email of 26/08/10 has a number of links relating to this. The email of 31/08/10 draws attention to the ‘Exclusive Brethren’ case. The email of 01/09/10 gives links to scientology web pages that explain ‘auditing’ and training.

22/10/10

Price List

A price list for the services provided making the point that the level of the charges take the scientologists out of the realm of charitable.

03/11/10

Forced or Coerced Abortions

A number of links to a number of news items etc relating to forced or coerced abortions.

05/11/10

Statement from an Ex-Scientologist

An account from Pete Griffiths of his time spent with the scientologists.

08/11/10

Hard Sell Packs

A link to ‘hard sell packs’ used in training.

09/11/10

Disconnection

A link to a website that discusses the practice of disconnection used by scientologists.

04/12/10

Big League Sales

A document that was circulated by L Ron Hubbard detailing sales techniques.

29/12/10

Camden Council

Mr Rashleigh-Berry states the following:

“It looks like Camden are trying to remove rates relief for 68 Tottenham Court Road.”

02/01/11

Clearwater, USA

A link to a web page detailing the ‘taking over’ of Clearwater, Florida by scientologists.

05/01/11 & 10/01/11

Maria Pia Gardini

A link to affidavits made by Maria Pia Gardini an ex-scientologist who wrote a book of her experiences.

05/01/11

Ex-Member of Staff of 51 Fawcett Street

A statement from an ex-member of staff detailing what services may be provided free and others that are provided at cost.

06/01/11

Religious Cloaking

Description of ‘religious cloaking’ with links to various web pages, including the Charity Commissioners.

09/01/11

Volunteer Ministers Program

Links to videos of scientology services.

These are summed up by Mr Rashleigh-Berry as follows:

“…the Volunteer Ministers program is primarily a dissemination tool used by the Church to advertise its presence, to introduce people to Scientology and to gain new recruits and that the actual help given to the community is on balance not beneficial.”

You put that across Excellent Roland , couple of small issue's , regarding video/audio sent to office computers , do they have speakers ? and I thought you were dealing with the solicitor's not steele .

The solicitor is a catalyst. Solicitors have to receive instructions from somebody or a group. They are not allowed to act off their own bat. The group being the Business Rates department so I have to deal with them and then they instruct the solicitor. That is the way it works.

I don't know if they have speakers. I assume they can sort something out if need be.

When they finally wake up to what they are dealing with they are going to shit themselves.

Edit: I am not sure about this but I think that the lady solicitor who was acting for law firm that took on the Bonnie Woods case pro bono had a nervous breakdown in a matter of days. That was the impression I got. I hope I was wrong.

That would'nt supprise me ,my head gets battered by this sometimes LOL .

When I came out the door this morning at 8:30 in the morning I saw this guy outside the leather bag shop browsing the leather bags in the windows. This was very unusual. As I walked round the corner he came round the same corner to browse the bags. This was more than unusual and has been noted. The only other time I picked up a definite tail was on one of Andreas Heldal-Lund's visit to London where the meeting arrangements got messed up. The bloody stupid PI who started up a conversation with me in the pub said he had to pop out and make a phone call and as he was going out said to me "I'll see you in a minute Roland". Then his jaw dropped and he saw me smiling and never came back in. I had not told him my name.

This tail I picked up (a tall thin guy, with white hair but fit-looking about 45) - when I got to the top of the road approaching the station he was parallel with me on the left and had obviously got there before me. He must have run plus known the short cut through the old post office building complex. This is far more than coincidence.

I will have to warn General Mudkips as he was going to stay a few days at my place to "sample the night life" (the less I know the better) after concluding a financial support deal with the pharmaceutical companies in Stuttgart.

This guy again - I was watching the film Jackal last night (with Bruce Willis) and this guy looked like a taller thinner version of him with the same sticking-up white hair.

Just what is it with these people? Why can't they hire decent PIs? I'm not supposed to KNOW I'm being followed, for f--- sake. And as for using just one person and him having to run like a lunatic through the old Post office compound to take a short cut through the car parks and him getting there before me as I reach the end of the next street then WTF goes on? You'd think that all those tax exempt charitable donations would be able to pay for better people than that.

You have your own IRL stalker? You're the guy who does xenu-directory, right? (Great site, btw). They aren't always discreet, intention is to intimidate?

IRL - wot dat? No, I am not xenu-directory. I don't have an anti web site any more (not for many years).

Yes, not at all discreet this one. He will almost certainly be on CCTV when he took a quick short cut through the old Post Office car parks when I was on the way to the station. (I live on Gerbergasse 5, Biberach/Riß, 88400 Germany - my route to the train station will be obvious as will his short cut).

Church of Scientology should not get rate break says Birmingham councillor

“No organisation refused registration by the Charity Commission for England and Wales is eligible for UK charity tax reliefs.”



Read More http://www.birminghammail.net/news/...ys-councillor-97319-27970198/2/#ixzz1ApcUGxph


Nice LOL .