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Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by MICHEL, Mar 8, 2010.

  1. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    That's abosultely right!

    Can you imagine, signing a $600,000.00 bond because the Cult gives you a few pieces of paper with 2 words that are "confidential". BT and Cluster.

    Plus, all this "extreme security" around these papers.

    If one wanted to control people, that's what one would do.

    A huge mystery around "nothing" so that others people reach to it, and the ones that have the "mystery" in hand, must make it more of a mystery.

    Michel.
  2. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Voila!

    This is the correct answer.

    Michel.
  3. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    Thanks a lot anonhoio.

    Michel
  4. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    Let see.....

    YOUR NICK NAME

    Flag Advanced Organization

    SOLO NOTs HGC

    200 North Osceola Avenue
    Clearwater, FL 33755, United States

    (727) 467-5099

    That will create some noise.

    Michel.
  5. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    You are welcome Blip.

    Michel.
  6. Zhent Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Lots of interesting and useful info in this thread, thanks.
  7. Anonymous Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Stop feeling stupid because the CoS is very good at what it does or else it wouldn't have survived this long. Look to the fact you managed to get out because plenty of people didn't.

    One day you will be reunited with your children.
  8. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides



    Thanks a lot for your compassion Anonymous.

    Hope that BVS is going to take my case.

    Michel.
  9. Lorelei Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Thank you for speaking out, Michel. It is much appreciated. Better yet, it may help critics of the human rights abuses within the cult make real and lasting change.

    Dare we hope that it will lead to the end of the cult, if the cult can not stop the human rights abuses its tenets and practices force members to accept?

    Either they learn to respect human rights and stop defrauding people, or they will continue to be pressured from within and without by a growing crowd of angry exes and critics.
  10. moarxenu Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Hi Michel!

    It is really great to have you here also because it appears you are in Italy. Wish we had a Anonymous cells in Italy. We need more Italian exes to speak out beside Maria Pia Gardini.

    Le Paoline, as you know, have become heroines for us.
  11. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Excelent! I am with you Lorelei.

    Michel.
  12. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    Hi moarxenu,

    Thanks for your support. I am in close comm with Maria Pia and we are preparing some new material we are going to use in France and Italy.

    Michel.
  13. hotdog57 Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Oh brother,The disconnection never stops and this cult never learns..not only are we not allowed to talk to are family, Scientology spreads evil lie,s about me to my familly..And any one else who leaves. See me on u-tube Michel it called,
    Scientologist confirms disconnection policy exist..
    The utube is less then 1 min. sorry about your familly .. Peter
  14. Rockyj Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    I've thought about Ex's like Aaron & Michel, then about Marty & the Freezoners, and I believe the unique difference here is Aaron & Michel have accepted reality, where as the others can't and they're stuck in denial. Perhaps they remain stuck because they don't want to believe that they've been duped for so many years. That Scientology is corrupt now only because of DM (like it wasn't before with LRH) so there must be something good about it! They may need this justification because if they accept the reality they also have to accept they wasted years out of their lives for nothing. And a very evil nothing at that!

    BTW way Michel, you are awesome & thanks for being here!
  15. anonohio Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Michel, there's a few doctors on this website (I'm one of them). I'm going to see about passing this information on to the ASCO (society of oncologists) and to the AMA (american medical association).

    This has been brought up before, and i've heard peripheral reports about it before....

    but internally do scientologists truly believe that scientology can cure cancer? Do they really believe that cancer is the result of engrams or whatever that can be audited out?

    Does that mean that if the cancer persists they believe there is still some spiritual condition the person hasn't dealt with?

    Is their advanced cancer a result of refusal of treatment because they believe scientology can cure it?

    If I remember correctly (It's been a long time since i read it) dianetics talks about cancer (along with asthma and other diseases), and how the root cause is not what western medicine thinks (e.g. it's rooted in engrams from the past?)
  16. Anonymous Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    I agree with you. I'd like to know at what stage is cancer recognized as cacner, ie how do they know that a person has cancer? AFAIK it can be difficult to detect in the early stages. Do people regularly see a doctor or some kind of 'medical officer'? When is it found out that a person has cancer in that environment?
  17. anonohio Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    clinically speaking, depending on the type of cancer, it can potentially be detected before it actually develops into cancer

    i imagine scientologists with cancer are diagnosed once they are symptomatic (like many people) the difference is in the decision to treat

    i should say that it is unethical to force someone to take cancer treatment (although there are exceptions). competent adults have every right to refuse treatment.
  18. mirele Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Michel,

    Thank you so much for this really fascinating information. It's so hard to get any reasonable data out of the "we have eight million, no nine million members" Co$. Finding out there are less than 10K Solo NOTS auditors (as of 2006) and more than half of those are in some sort of condition that precludes auditing until they straighten up their status...well! (I also liked the sly dig at Tommy Davis.)

    I am not a math genius / financial wiz, but what occurred to me when reading your numbers is that we could possibly figure out, if we had high and low figures on what Solo NOTS auditors might spend on their six months checks, how much money is going through Flag just for that per year.

    So, for example, there's $1,700 for the C/S two times a year for 1,000 people who are on green tags, which according to you are people who are regularly coming in to get their checks. That's a minimum of $3,400,000 just for C/Sing those people. This doesn't include their NOTS intensives (2 or 3 at $8,000 each). Does each person HAVE to get a NOTS intensive in addition to the C/Sing? Or can you just go into Flag and get the C/S done and then leave? I would imagine the regging for an intensive is pretty fierce.

    (And, just as a thought, if a couple hundred people have dropped off green tag to gray, orange or lower, can you imagine the screaming coming from Little Napoleon? My goodness, the money train has stopped coming!)

    Any further information or light you can shed on this is greatly appreciated!
  19. hotdog57 Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Scientologist believe that all illness is from the ingram or inplant. The frist book Dianetic 100 percent for mental and 80 percent physical..
  20. PodPeople Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    FYI, there are other questions/info that would be pertinent to the above:
    Scientologists time/money pressures (whatever you have, more is demanded) induces long term stress, physical and mental; extreme stress

    Sci's at the level Michel is talking about have been involved over a very long period of time. Besides get rich schemes, there is also an attraction to medical quackery. Not all alternative is automatically quack, but sci's will go to sci doctors if available; often go to sci chiropractors for wide array of symptoms; Hulda Clark's "cure for all cancers" and "cure for all diseases" was widely promoted (by her publicist, scientologist David Amrein) Here's one link about this quackery:
    The Bizarre Claims of Hulda Clark

    Would be helpful to know their ages, what types of cancer, and how long in sci. (most on higher ot levels are middle aged to seniors)
  21. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    I totally agree with you Rockyj. It would be the biggest loss they ever experiencied!
    They just need to accept the real world. You know, they are still "over there".
    Hope that they will realize that all this is just BS.
    Otherwise, that means that they have other intentions.

    Michel.
  22. anonohio Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    holy crap

    and i thought i'd heard it all. i stand corrected
  23. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides



    Hmm..

    But this thread was about cancer.. Stress have been mentioned as a probable cause.. I did in fact get cancer in 1984 (tumor removed sucessfully in surgery). I'd blown the GO 2 years before that, and was still married to a hardcore scientologist. At the time there was some scientific research that seemed to indicate that 'passive stress' was a factor. Passive Stress, being when you were in an oppressive situation and unable to do anything about it.

    I referred to this research when I sued the cult in 1987, but my atty didn't think it was useful in the case.

    :yes:[/QUOTE]



    Hello Anonohio,

    Here is the Thread i am running in ESMB.

    MICHEL - CANCER AND SUICIDE ON SOLO NOTS - Ex Scientologist Message Board



    "What you are saying is very interesting.

    The passive stress theory looks like the PTS/SP one, oppressive situation and unable to do anything about it.

    The Cult's answer is to find the SP and handle him (becoming a Scientologist) or disconnect.

    Each indicator of PTSness is handled this way. No need for a doctor. "The standard tech" will handle everything.

    Business is business, isn't.

    I thing that this is the key point to attack the Clut on the subject of cancer

    The substitution of medical attention by the "PTS/SP" tech.

    Imagine going to trail and showing the PTS/SP references about illnesses.



    "There are two stable data which anyone has to have, understand and know are true in order to obtain results in handling the person connected to suppressives.

    These data are:

    1. That all illness in greater or lesser degree and all foul-ups stem directly and only from a PTS condition.

    2. That getting rid of the condition requires three basic actions: (A) Discover; (B) Handle or (C) Disconnect."

    LRH



    Of course, one cannot be PTS of Scientology, Scientologists, Sea Org members, LRH, DM, etc...

    They are the "angels". They can't be suppressive. They have the greatest goal in the universe: "Clearing the Planet, and then the Universe".

    That's their justification.:angry:

    Michel"





    "As SN DofP I was on the front line re: the administration of Solo Nots.

    There was a huge RTC pressure over the Senior C/S FSO and the SN C/Ses to put the PTS/SP tech 100% in.

    I am just pointing out that despite the “PTS/SP tech”, which is supposed to handle any illness, there was so many OT7 and OT8 with cancer, HIV, diabetes, financial irregularities, accidents, etc..

    I personally bought the “PTS/SP tech idea” and applied it in my life for 20 years.

    Recently, I did, for the first time since 20 years, a complete medical check and it was found that my prostate increased in volume, which, if not cured on time, could become cancerous.

    Now, here is the deal.

    How about, if I didn’t blew the Sea Org? There is NO medical care in the Sea Org!

    Beppe G. was found with a cancerous tumor the size of an egg in his brain, while at Flag to attest to OT7.

    The PTS/SP tech is used in Scientology to control people and keep them away from any medical control.

    The PTS/SP tech deny the use of medicine and medical care.

    The Cult’s handling is as follows:

    • Ethics interview and handle or disconnect from the ”SP”
    • NOTs Auditing to handle the “case matter” connected to it.(1 or 2 intensives)
    • PTS/SP GAT course.

    $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$!!!!

    I don’t know how this data could be used to stop the Cult from monopolizing the health care of its public and staff.

    Maybe some medical associations could do something about this.

    Maybe it could be used right away in Australia?

    Michel."




    Please let me know if you have any questions.

    Michel.
  24. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Michel, keep up the good work. You are helping more people being on the outside then you did when you were in. Kudos to you sir!
  25. PodPeople Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Question, Michel. When any in that group went mentally bonkers, were they tagged as "ethics" or illness? Curious, since scientology says there's no such thing as mental illness.
  26. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    would they have been labled PTS also?
  27. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    I am going to explain Anonymous,

    The medical officer is not a doctor. He is only a Medical Liaison Officer. The person has to go to the doctor by himself. If he doesn't go then it's his responsability.

    Now, the point is that a PTS condition means that the person is connected to an SP and thus, must handle or disconnect from it.

    The majority of the time the "SP"is a familly member or a friend. So, people are at FEAR about being sick or ill.

    That means that they MUST disconnect from a familly member or friend in order to continue to get auditing or training.

    And, of course they paid in advance their course and auditing. Plus, a PTS condition means more auditing than what was expected.

    Moreover, being PTS is such a shame! (That's what you feel like when you are a Scientologist.)

    Those are the factors that affect the Scientologist decision in getting regular medical check....FEAR to be PTS.

    Michel
  28. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    this in itself should be illegal BIG time
    scaring people into not seeking medical attention has to break laws left and right
    Especially coming from a "church"
    No to mention the CHILDREN of these members.

    Christian Scientists are always on the chopping block due to their stance on medical intervention. But you never hear too much about Scientology being guilty of that.

    Michel, when are you going to contact some people and do an interview?
    You have so much to offer!
  29. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Hello Mirele,

    There is another source of income that doesn't cost anything to the Cult....Donations for the IAS and SUPER POWER.

    And guess who are the main donators?

    You got it! The OT7 and OT8, the "elite" of Scientology!

    And here we are talking about huge $$$$$$$$$ without any service in exchange.

    Now, if you add what the Green and Grey (2,100) generate in income for servives plus the IAS patron status ($40,000.00 minimum) and the SUPER POWER Cornerstone Status ($35,000.00 minumum)...

    Humm let see....

    2,100 x 30k = $63,000,000.00 the year in services

    2,100 x 75k = $157,500.00000 in donations

    I am not even talking about the donations made for the IDEAL ORGS and the NEW BOOK RELEASES.

    `If a man really wanted to make a million dollars, the best way to do it would be start his own religion.' LRH


    He did it!

    Michel.
  30. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Which is why there is an IAS and Super Power building class action lawsuit going. amirite?
  31. PodPeople Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    "pts" is part of the ethics "package". The sci rule is, you had to do something unethical in order to become effect (PTS) of some big bad SP. It helps if you get the overall picture: Anything bad happens to you, it's you're fault. Anything good, it's because of sci. (sigh)
  32. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Not true?
    I thought if you had a cold you can be labeled PTS
    doesn't have to be anything bad that you did.
    any injury like a sprained ankle or what have you can make you PTS
    And yes they convince people they pulled it in

    EDITED, although again there are different types of PTS
    like PTS Type III

    "A person suffering a psychotic breakdown due to connection with an anti-Scientologist or psychiatrist, supposedly. Often this label is applied to people who flip under the incredible strain of Scientology's paranoid bullshit. PTS Type Three's are then placed on the Introspection Rundown, where they are locked up to hide them from authorities, who don't like to see people driven round the bend by the cult, and may make waves"
  33. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    I agree with you RightOn. I am so ashamed when i remember the way these poor guys (the OT7 and OT8) were/are treated by the sea Org, DM and LRH.

    I'll do wathever i have to do to stop this.

    Michel.
  34. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Try not to dwell on that, (although it must be hard)
    Look forward on making things better and to the day we can all rejoice when the abuses halt.
  35. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    If one goes mentally bonker he is sais to be PTS Type 3. (he thinks that everybody around him is an SP)

    It's an Ethic matter.

    He shouldn't have been accepted in Scientology for services from the begining.


    Michel.
  36. PodPeople Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    Religious status was sought for tax protection And malpractice protecton. All sci's Must get permission from sci officer/staff to go to a doctor. No sci can sue another sci for anything, including medical malpractice, without being kicked out (declared suppressive) and more than likely fairgamed for doing so. Medical malpractice has always been rampant in sci.

    This thread link has some doc's about this. It's a thread on sci med malpractice.
    Medical malpractice in the Church of Scientology - Ex Scientologist Message Board

    As far as cancer, there's anecdotal reports of abnormally high rates for sci staff, especially sea org. Sorry, don't have a thread on it. There's no medical insur for one thing, plus abhorrent health/physical conditions. But also, old sci buildings were renovated over the years, many of which had asbestos. And then there's the Freewinds, noted to have had blue asbestos (this would have affected both staff and public).

    Sci doctors are often part of W.I.S.E sci groups, and again, any arbitration is carried out internally.
  37. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    Exactly!

    As a matter of fact, prior to being posted as a SN DofP i have been working 6 years on the Super Power Project. The shell and core construction of the building started in 1999 and was completed in 2002.

    The funding for the entire Super Power Project (about $90,000.000.00 estimation done in 2004) was completed in 2004.

    Laurie Webster called DM and told him that the funding was completed.

    She received order form him to keep going with the donation collection! I was there when she got DM's order.

    Laurie is still asking for donations to "fund" the Super Power Building. I think that she is up to $150,000.000.00.

    No comments.

    Michel.
  38. RightOn Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    wow would love to see a copy of that order. lol

    You should go on ESMB and let the people in that class action suit know you were present when DM gave the order to keep collecting for the Super Power. I think that would be worth it's weight in gold for the people who are pressing charges?
    it would prove fraud
  39. MICHEL Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides


    Yes, PTS type 3.

    "A psychotic that beleive that everyone around him is an SP"

    Yes, he must disconnect from everybody...i know....i know......

    Michel.
  40. PodPeople Member

    Re: Solo NOTs auditors - data on total numbers and cancer and suicides

    You can search the leaks thread for ethics packs, which would include pts stuff.
    It is very much true.

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