Discussion in 'Freedom of Expression' started by Anonymous, Feb 4, 2011.
A picture just came up in my head:
It's 1776, and somewhere in the American colonies, a lazy apathetic Tory sits on his ass while whining like a little bitch about how "barbaric" the American revolutionaries are for tearing down courthouses, tarring and feathering tax collectors, assassinating british generals, and burning down a city.
Meanhile a pregnant woman named Molly Pitcher mans a cannon against the British....
Now it's 2011, and some people still want to armchair quarterback like whiny little bitches, only this time they whine about something as harmless as DDOS.
Some things never change.
It's easy: DDOS is civil disobedience when anon does it, like when Alter and Azazel helped with titstorm. It's a censhorship driven crime when j45t3r does it to WL and the FBI better bust him first. The hivemind of 19 people will then contort themselves trying to rationalize their support of such bullshit after the fact.
Truth is, ddos is straight outta the troll's toolbox and no amount of pretzel logic will make it "civil disobedience." Rosa parks didn't break the fucking bus and tell others they couldn't ride it.
And how is DDOS not armchair quarterbacking? You're some guy running a script, pretending you're doing something when you're really doing nothing. The DDOS frees the Egyptians about as well as changing your Facebook profile pic to a cartoon ends child abuse, or about as much as prayer effects fate.
I never said, nor implied that. I wasn't attempting to make a parallel between her and Anonymous. What she did was a pacifictic action, while a DDOS is anything but. The only similarity is that yes, they broke the law in the name of activism. But that doesn't make them one and the same.
While I don't necessarily agree with DDOSing, it's ability to help galvanize those in oppressive regimes is powerful. While it may not achieve much, those who commented that it makes those in power scared are correct. Governments in countries like Tunisia, Egypt, Burma and so on cling to power because of fear. The DDOS attacks act as a symbol that there are people outside the country who are not afraid to stand up and help those being oppressed. That, in turn, helps them gain the courage, en masse to speak up. One or two people standing up can easily be put in gaol without reprise, but thousands upon thousands, that's where the DDOS helps. While I don't condone it, it has helped.
LIAR. I'm saving the entire middle east and i StILL have time to play Minecraft. Fuck you, I MATTER.
You honestly think these people are scared by being DDOS'd?
I gotta hand it to you. Most trolls get bored on go back to their WoW or GTA by now.
Of course they're terrified of being DDOS'd. They btotally won't take it out on the citizens they're attacking. Press on, anonymous. Fuck those Egyptians saying stay out of it, let's DDOS them too.
I disagree that doing virtually nothing is useful, I must be some kind of stupid troll or something!
Yup. Now you are getting it.
It lets malodorous basement dwellers feel like they're doing something other than living off of their parents' largess. Keep fucking that chicken fatties.
I don't run scripts.
And there's a BIG difference between actually DOING something (i.e. DDOS) and simply complaining about what's being done without even bothering to offer a better alternative.
And before you ask me what I've done, I'll go ahead and tell you:
1) assessed the accuracy of information to then pass on to others.
2) aided in the Proxy-Cloud when Egypt shut the Internet off, while also getting the word out to others to help out.
3) contacted a few influential members of SFFWA (Science Fiction & Fantasy Writers Association) who then blogged about what was happening in Egypt so that their fan-base could spread the word (and also help out in the Proxy Cloud)
4) got a few other authors on board (both those in big press and small press) to bring in posts on pro-Egypt Revolution pages on Facebook that was getting spammed by Mubarak's goon squad in an attempt to demoralize the Egyptian people. Suffice it to say, the goon squad's comments got deeply buried.
5) Also got in touch with ex-military family members who have Communications as their MOS and asked them to help out with the blackout problem as well.
What have you done besides just whine and complain?
Of course. Don't tell them their work doesn't matter. Their sexting each other in irc totally effecting ddos slacktivism is super effective and totally caused the Egyptian revolution. There'd be no Wikileaks if not for Gregg's tireless efforts!
Which all sound helpful as compared to SoDDing Yemen.
We don't DDoS, so if that was a confession, gtfo.
I've expressed legitimate concern for people who think DDOS'ing is the answer. And it doesn't matter whether I've helped or not, my opinion is still quite valid. There is really nothing much me, who lives half way around the world, can do but read and watch the reports and latest updates.
I think it's funny that you are under the impression that DDoS is more effective than whining and complaining, or scratching one's balls.
You sound like a teabagger. How close am I? Your use if multiple strawmen in one post is impressive.
Seeing as this is WWP a community which by it's own admission is attempting to foster open social interaction between people, governments and enterprise I feel it's important to ask the following questions of this community who are largely reading/responding to this thread.
1) When Chanology began in January of 2008, Distributed Denial of Service "DDOS" attacks were not only common place, but were the preferred method of "harpooning" the Scientologists. When it was brought to light this activity was underhanded and trivial by Mark Bunker, a concentrated effort was undertaken to turn the ship around and go into professional and civil activism (not disobedience). Using Chanology as a frame of reference what do you believe makes this situation any different now that it is dealing with real-world and adult matters and politics.
2) DDOS attacks were heavily controversial during Chanology and were frowned upon and indeed, hardly ever discussed at large on this site prior to Freedom of Information campaigns here taking root. I ask two questions - If you participated in Chanology early-on to around this time, what was your position on DDOS attacks and their legality and effect on the legitimacy of this "movement" as an activist organization as a whole.
2a) If you believe DDOS attacks were illegal and now seek to speak of them favorably or advocate their usage - what has changed since Chanology that makes this legitimate now?
-- Bonus Question for Gregg Housh --
I just finished watching the interview on CNN; quite an interesting piece of work. However, I noticed around the 1:20m mark in the interview you told the commentator you were involved in the "attacks on the CHURCH OF SCIENTOLOGY" what did that comment mean? The commentator did not probe it but I'm curious what the word "attacks on" eludes to exactly.
I would assume that "attacks on" means the protests however the last time I assumed the Internal Revenue Service sent me a threatening letter saying I owed them $3,000 not $0.03 which admittedly is my fault since I cannot count or read. However, they didn't need to be cock stains about it.
Ever hear of Psyops (Psychological Operations)? You'd be surprised how something as simple and relativley harmless as a DDOS can affect the psyche of a control-freak dictator. An historical example is how the Britsh responded to something as silly as a bunch of people disguised as Indians dumping tea into a harbor.
You'd also be surprised how something so relatively minor can boost the moral of protestors that are getting gunned down in the streets.
True, there are many other actions that can be taken. And DDOSsing alone amounts to little or nothing.
But when all those different tactics get focused on a single government, coming from all directions, with no apparent top-down control mechanism involved, and it's a sustained assault with no means of predicting what might come next....
Well, you can imagine how Mubarak is feeling right about now.
What experience do you have with PSYOPS against large nation states? I hope it's a lot, that's a pretty learned position to have from someone who can't probably be much older than thirty.
I'd be pretty shocked too if a nation of people too illiterate and lazy to oust a dictator after thirty years ousted my ass. I don't know if I'd be scared though.
Wow, you totally helped ask some bloggers to blog some shit. That's some 133t activism, must have took you like, twenty entire minutes. Muy effective, dude. Didn't have to leave the house or nothing.
I didn't take part in Chanology back in the day, but I did keep track of their progress and approved of their methods. I also understood the wisdom of not DDOSsing the CoS.
But the main difference between the CoS and dictators like Mubarak is the CoS didn't gun down protestors in the streets. (Although, I'm sure the CoS would if they had the military/government backing to do so--and in that case, well....).
syops, is that like looking at Mubarak and trying to make his head explode?
CRUSH THE DICTATORS WITH YOUR MIND!
I understand what you are saying. Now how about you look at it from the other side, since you like Psyops.
I'm a dictator that has had absolute control with zero oversight for x number of years. I'm not afraid of beating, burning, gutting or shooting citizens of my country, that disagree with me, in the torso, ass or head. Now, I have a popular uprising in my country, some random fucktards decide to cut off my govt. site while there are protesters in the streets. I still have control of the (insert whatever organization you need to here) and I'm not afraid to use them. Holy shit, you scared me with your DDoS. I say to the other guy, "go shot some people".
Wow, that really helped the protesters.
Thanks. You're a hero.
Other course this was all fiction - any threats of violence should be taken as me mocking the person I'm replying to and not serious.
I just think we should all be helpful and nice. Is that so wrong?
Oh, I'm older than thirty, plus I'm a compulsive researcher with a high I.Q. I also come from a military family. So, yes, I am "pretty learned". Learned enough to know how vital communication is on a battlefield. It is, after all, one of the first things that gets targeted, and for good reason. And yes, situations where protestors are getting gunned down in the streets is considered a battle field.
Wow! What a well-researched and intelligent assessment! [/sarcasm].
Heh, anyone who calls a nation lazy is domebound, I hope. Or worse.
Actually, it took me a couple weeks total to do that and more. Which cut into my post-dayjob time, which means no extra moola, which means I'm behind on my bills once again. Again, what have you done other than whine like a castrated gecko?
I'm not the person replying to you - but I will say you're a slow ass fuck. I leveled a holy priest in WOW without using LFD or Battlegrounds from 1-80.
Wait, a compulsive researcher with a high IQ and leet blogger friends has to work for hourly wages? Say it ain't so!
Wow, that's a real smug attack. AGP?!?
I used my wits and leveled a slacktivist who thinks he's special for taking a few hours out of his week to have absolutely zero effect on anything but the air in his egopump.
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