Scientology’s 2011 book value for just two of its entities is $1.2 billion

Discussion in 'Media' started by The Wrong Guy, Apr 7, 2014.

  1. The Wrong Guy Member

    SHOCK DOX: Scientology’s 2011 book value for just two of its entities is $1.2 billion

    By Tony Ortega

    The Underground Bunker has copies of some stunning documents that were just released by our old friend, Jeff “OTVIIIisgrrr8!” Augustine over at his website. They are 990-T returns for the 2011 tax year submitted by the Church of Scientology International and the Church of Spiritual Technology, and they show that CSI and CST — which are just two of Scientology’s many entities, have a combined book value of $1.2 billion.

    Since 1993, Scientology has had tax-exempt status, and your tax dollars have helped the church amass huge wealth. It puts constant pressure on its members to donate huge amounts, it pays its workers pennies an hour because it is exempt from labor laws, and the result are these incredible amounts.

    First, here’s the Church of Scientology International’s 2011 tax form, which shows in the upper left of the first page that its book value was $790,758,896.

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  2. wolfbane Member

    SHOCK DOX: Scientology’s 2011 book value for just two of its entities is $1.2 billion
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  3. Random guy Member

    I'm not an accountant, but if I read this correctly, Narconon saw their balance drop from a positive $ 1,5 million in 2011 to a loss of $ 4,8 million in 2012, almost all of which is traceable to an increase in "Other expenses (Part IX, column (A), lines 11a-11d, 11f - 24e)" from 6,3 million in 2011 to 14,7 million in 2012. Would anyone know what these "other expenses" entail? Are we seeing the mother cult bleeding Narconon of funds to avoid paying, or is this the legal expenses?
  4. Random guy Member

  5. Random guy Member

    From John P., over at the Bunker:

    John P. [COLOR=rgba(0, 39, 59, 0.34902)]4 hours ago
    I don't have a lot of time to go through this in detail, but a couple of things stand out. First, a goodly chunk of the book value could be for real estate. Many of the Ideal Orgs are relatively new and as such don't have a lot of depreciation on them. As a result, a significant portion of the value of CSI could be the current value of the Ideal Orgs. Let's assume that those cost an average of $10 million each and there are about 40 of them. That would yield a book value of about $400 million. While the trophy properties (Hollywood, Flag, Hemet) are worth much more, there is a lot of depreciation that has been taken so the book value is a bit lower as a percentage of their actual cost than the Ideal Orgs. We might find another $200 million in total for those, if those properties are actually owned by CSI. I don't have any idea whether Flag is a subsidiary of CSI, so I can't tell whether the value of the Super Power building "rolls up" into the book value of CSI.
    The point is that a goodly chunk of the CSI number could be real estate. It's not clear how much of the CST value is real estate, much of which is in remote locations and probably isn't worth that much on the open market. I'm wondering if they have assigned an inflated value to the "scriptures" on the stainless steel pages in the titanium vaults, though I can't say why they might do that.
    The low book value for Celebrity Centre is not surprising, because they have had that building for a long time and thus they have depreciated most of the value of the building.
    It's not possible to go from the little bits here to get to the total revenue for the cult, unfortunately. And this doesn't point to the cash balances, since those are probably held in entities away from CSI, like RTC or a complex network of offshore trusts that don't have to report Form 990s to the IRS.[/COLOR]
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  6. Random guy Member

  7. RightOn Member

    Wonder if anyone is looking into COS's offshore trusts, or are they just being left alone.
  8. Random guy Member

    Apparently, ASI is missing for the list. According to Chuck Beaty, this is the unit handling the money stream from the lower organizations into RTC.
  9. wolfbane Member

    Post got updated with Rinderburn analysis that is worth reading.
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  10. Scientologist Terril Park leaked an alleged e-mail from <> to ESMB, with additional financial info. (ESMB post).

    I suppose Rathbun's "troops" are now allowed to accept that the Church is NOT dead. More likely his troops were just being "fabian" all along. The following transcript is a telephone conversation between Scientologists Michael Doven (MD) and Mark Rathbun (MR) from 2010.

    So, looks like DM was right. With Rathbun, Rinder, et al focusing the opposition, Scientology has been expanding like never before.
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  11. OK, I decided to roll up the sleeves with my calculator to see what the cult finances might be based on the information on TO's blog, some Googled information and a few educated guesses. Please give input if you think the numbers should be something else based on information you have.

    The 990-T's on TO's blog come out to:

    2011: $1,226,246,213
    2012: $350,980,558

    TOTAL: $1,577,226,771

    But that doesn't include a whole bunch of other corporations: RTC, IASA, CSRT, plus all the individual Sea Org units, churches, advanced orgs, missions, Narconons and other front groups around the world.

    Rinderburn2 says in his comments on TO's blog that IASA has not only one billion but TWO billion. (BTW, how come he's only saying that now?)

    There are no guesses by Rinderburn2 about CSRT. But they paid for the $160 million Stupid Powerz building that opened in 2013, which wasn't even reflected in the 2012 990-T for Flag Service Organization.

    The individual churches in the US and everything else they have in the rest of the world isn't listed either. But they have, per quick Google search, 139 churches plus 5 advanced organizations. If each one averages about $7.5 million (what seems to be around how much they raise for an ideal morgue - some places like the UK and New York were announced as something like $30 or $40 million), that's another one billion right there.

    We're now up to about $4.75 billion.

    Then there are the missions (over 330), Narconons (about 100), CCHRs, any other front groups. But if there were about 500 of these and they averaged $500,000 each, that's another $250 million.

    So now it's $5 billion.

    And then there's the money in their bank accounts all over the world. Hey, this is wild guess, but all together, it's probably at least another billion.

    Oh, and I forgot about the mother of them all, RTC. I don't even have a clue how much they have. But I bet it's gonna be around as much as CSI or CST. So let's say about $500 million.

    What does that come out to? About $6.5 BILLION. Give or take a billion or two.

  13. Random guy Member

    Those are total funds, including buildings and stuff. While they represent a lot of dosh, they also are also essential Captain Miscavige's make believe show for the culties. The moment he starts selling off property, he has a very bad image problem, which may strip him of his whales.

    The really interesting question is how much they have in liquid assets. John P. is of the opinion that it isn't really all that much, but it remains to be seen if he's right.
  14. DeathHamster Member

    ASI is a for-profit, wholly owned by CST. There shouldn't be a 990 for it.
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  15. wolfbane Member

    That seems like a very conservative number for a VERY small number of enitites on the extended corporate tree. So factor in that we for each 990 we got, there's a dozen more religious corporations we didn't get... all of which get 75-90% of their income from donations and services not report... 25-30 billion seems like a conservative minimum. 100-150 billion, worldwide and including the trusts where the real money is at, wouldn't even shock me.

    Yeah I know, not helping. :(

    But it's probably a good reality check to keep in mind in relation to the pending lawsuits - the cult can EASILY hemorrhage tens of millions of dollars, in a dozen or more lawsuit settlements, which includes spending a few mil fighting each one, and not even bat an eye sell a big ideal org property.
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  16. tinfoilhatter Member

    legal expenses would show up as "legal expenses" as well as outside contractor expenses for the lawyers.

    Which narconon entity are we talking about, as they all have separate 990s. I have not seen any huge losses with the American side of narconon HOWEVER, I do not have access to the foreign side of things.

    Those are huge dox, and it takes LOTS of coffee and free time to go through them. You will go mad looking at the numbers. So i might have missed something or could be wrong.

    This sounds like expenses going over seas however.
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  17. tinfoilhatter Member

    From what i have seen of cult 990s, they are not healthy financially. We are also 2 years behind too. It costs lots of money for them to harass people, and to do shady moonbat things. I will have to read through these later, with the FASAB handbook.
  18. The only 990 I saw was for Narconon International, which to my knowledge has not been hit with a judgment or paid a settlement.

    The set-up with Scientology, Narconon, etc. appears to be similar to that of the Catholic Church, where each diocese is a separate corporation. The mother Catholic Church in Rome was not paying child molestation settlements. Instead, if necessary a diocese sold assets and I believe in one case threatened to enter bankruptcy.

    Also, I'm not sure a judgment, settlement or defense costs would show up as legal expenses if they are covered by insurance.
  19. tinfoilhatter Member

    John p is spot on about the depreciation of the buildings. the IRS has a special rate that is used.

    the 6.5 billion is over inflated. Because they are a tax free entity, they can do that, and there is no penalty for that. However, this does not take into consideration real market value. This burns lots of companies trying to sell real estate. The 6.5 billion comes from the purchase price of the buildings, not the real market value. If the buildings are in bad condition, then they would not sell, or sell for a low value, if they sold at all.

    Then there is the UBI tax for when they sold the buildings, even at a loss.

    for a 60 year old entity, 6.5 billion is not a lot of money. It also is probably taking into consideration their "intellectual property".

    these 990s indicate that the cult is not healthy. They also explain whey they are desperate to raise prices and milk whales.
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  20. RolandRB Member

    ^^ Just get the chumps to redo their Bridge with each GAT release. Problem solved!
  21. I want the cult to go down as much as anyone. But come on man. You cannot convince me that ANY entity with $6.5 billion is not a lot of money. Or that any organization which owns every one of their motherfucking buildings outright - because they pay for them in cash - could be considered "not healthy."

    Besides, if you think that "only" $6.5 billion is too low, wolfbane estimates the cult's wealth conservatively at $25-30 million.

    Any way you cut it, this fucking sucks.
  22. amaX Member

    How much money does an alcoholic cult leader need to abscond to a South American country and live out his days paying for security and new livers every three years?
  23. Budd Member

    Good luck trying to "spin" this one!
  24. Anonylemmi Member

    The moar money they have, the bigger the cat-fight over it will be. I cannot predict when it will happen, but I guarantee it will be lulzy.
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  25. snippy Member

    Needing tutoring is a different kind of desperation than needing rehab, so it's tougher to scam people. Also, educators outside the Applied Scholastics bubble constantly evaluate students, so it's easy for parents to see whether the tutoring is helping or not. When the kids start doing worse in school, parents stop forking over the money.
  26. OTeleventy Member

    You all wonder why former TX supremer Wallace Jefferson wants to represent the cult? This is why. This whole fucking thing depresses me.
  27. snippy Member

    The insurance companies are on to Narconon, both their gross negligence and their proclivity to commit insurance fraud. The insurance company got sued right along with Narconon GA and incurred it's own legal fees. The insurance company likely paid the settlement in that wrongful death case, but this will come back on Narconon.
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  28. Well, yes, in a bad way. It's impossible to say the cult is shrinking when they have somewhere between $6 billion to $30 billion. Maybe over $100 billion. I'm even having trouble typing that out.
    ^Yeah, this. :(
  29. Depends on what you are measuring.

    It is definitely shrinking in terms of membership, services performed (auditing - training), sales, etc.

    It probably isn't shrinking in terms of money and assets. Mostly because after one reaches a certain point, if one does not screw up too horrible, interest, return on safe investments, etc. tends to preserve assets.

    I read once - I believe years ago, I certainly can't take credit for it - that Scientology may wind up like Christian Science. That is, with the equivalent of numerous empty reading room, but living comfortably off of its accumulated assets.

    I've always doubted predictions that the COS was going to go broke any time soon. I'm tempted to say it doesn't matter much, because in many (but not all) ways the COS is a spent force. Unfortunately, I can't do that because the COS clearly has plenty of money to pay PIs and attorneys, and thus to harass and harm people.

    That, unfortunately, may not end anytime soon.
  30. amaX Member

    Shit. If y'all think this is over then I'm packing it in.
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  31. Random guy Member

    I don't think paying the lawyers or settlements will ruin the cult financially, at least not in the short run. However, as CommunicatorIC said, the cult is sliding rapidly downhill. At some pint it will cease to be relevant, and that will bee the end of whales and celebrities. If the cult by then decides to sell off and hire out it's buildings, it can remain as a sort of real estate holding company. If on the other hand Captain Miscavige insists on keeping the Sea Org afloat and the idle orgs in pristine shape, the cult will burn through it's assets relatively quickly (well, as quickly as you can burn through billions).

    We do see that the cult fails to maintain a proper pressure on critics and effectively coordinate their lawsuits. While they may have billions to pay for lawyers, they do not have the staff or the brain power to function well. With the abusive history of the cult, and the apparent wealth they hold, someone will start exploring ways to get at those funds if they are no longer guarded effectively (Ray Jeffrey, hint, hint). The Christian Science analogy does not hold, as CS are not known to tick people off to the same degree.

    There is also the question of what the liquid assets actually look like. They may hold billions, but it is hard to imagine them holding billions and at the same time being so cash strapped as they seems to be. Also, having billions is liquid assets (if they actually do) won't help them as long they (i.e. Captain Miscavige) won't spend them.
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