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Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

Discussion in 'GoldBase' started by mnql1, Aug 8, 2009.

  1. TinyDancer Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    You did "do something", as far as I'm concerned. Let me add my congrats. Without your work, AO would have faced trial on a felony charge and we would not still be salivating at the prospect of much WIN yet to come.
  2. fitch2000 Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    didn't Graham's summary or w/e it was I read say they had found a survey(done by the cult). Does anyone know what that summary said? Will we find out tomorrow? (Yes, I read the AO thread, but didn't really understand what is going on tomorrow.)
  3. ARC Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    If you reveal the identities of anons etc. you get banned.

    If AnonOrange wants to have his account back he can contact the admins. Even though I don't know the full details of what he did - I haven't seen the pictures, don't know the real names of those involved etc - I don't think it's likely that he'll get the account back.

    There should be enough cross-readership of these forums that any important updates about AnonOrange's case gets attention.
  4. Smurf Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Obviously from this post & your other postings, you have no legal experience.

    Gold Base is divided by Hwy 79 which is administered by Caltrans. The RTC, and any other owners of private property that have state roads running through its boundaries have to submit to a litany of guidelines, state statutes, highway legislation, etc.

    Likewise, if Hwy 79 were to "close down" (which isn't likely anytime soon), Scientology would have to file applications with the state establishing ownership of the property which the state may challenge. It is not as black-and-white as you suggest.
  5. TinyDancer Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Have you (and the other naysayers) actually read what Suzette has said?

    The issue is not so much who OWNS the land, but whether or not there's a public easement on it.
  6. Smurf Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Yes. If Suzette had done some simple research (i.e., Google), she would have found answers to questions about public easements. California has established street & highway codes which are supervised & enforced by Caltrans. http://law.justia.com/california/codes/shc.html.
  7. xoixoi1 Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    I've always felt there was something fishy about the politics and justice system of Hemet. The scilons have always had the goal of infiltrating and bringing into line the local public servants. With the importance of Gold Base, it wouldn't surprise me if they have already corrupted the local government in that part of CA.

    All this just makes the cult look more freeky.
  8. xenubarb Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    What are you, the frigging Batman? We couldn't have orchestrated this better! You got the video necessary for evidence of the assault. My intervention kept the footage on AO's camera intact. Your intervention when Danny was trying to assume custody of my person was, erm, timely.

    I'm surprised that the cult hasn't threatened to bring out their footage! (yes, we know you haz. It's what you do, Scientology!) Perhaps their footage would only corroborate our accounts of what happened.

    The whole thing seemed scripted by a jokester deity, especially since we were literally minutes from leaving to go visit Ida. And the cult's offer to drop charges if AO would admit to "yelling" is particularly lulzy, since you can hear their 110 db organ tritone baying in the background of the video. And this happened the day before DM was to return from the big IAS event in the UK, where he got to strut around being Mr. Important for a nice weekend.

    The huge diff between this and Keith Henson's case is the video. Lots of it. Property lines, etc. are not being discussed here for a reason. Suffice it to say, there are a number of surveys on record and we haz them.

    I'm gonna keep on and make this post tl;dr because you have to know that Scientology has been encroaching on public property for years. They even got the old 79 closed for a week, "for filming."
    This closure was meant to last a month. After a stream of complaints from outraged motorists who use that road to reach the I-10 to LA and Palm Springs, it reopened in a week.

    We never learned who issued permission for that closure, but somehow Muriel DuFresne convinced an official that they really, really needed to film the night sky from the middle of the highway for a month. Never mind all the vacant open space on the base! I would still like to find out what genius rubberstamped that decision and why.

    Scientology installed its fences on the easement and was trying to get Rcide to give them special dispensation to leave them there. And yet, the fences are now moved back onto their own property. They did manage to get permission for a traffic island on a public street, which forces cars closer to the edge, where there is no place to walk except in the gutter. The landscaping all the way to the curb is also meant to force protesters to walk in the road.

    They have set up these conditions which could endanger public safety, then they invoke the danger at the Board of Supes meetings about ordinance 881.

    They don't realize they've been smacked back some this year. The fence. The citizens' arrests. The lies. And yet, they are still acting as if they are above the law. The destruction of some evidence in AO's case, for example. There are certainly other shenanigans being pulled that will come out in court. Buckle up! This is gonna be an E-ticket ride!
  9. Anonymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    I'm not doubting you, Barb, but I've read this about the fences being moved several times in the last few days. Do we have any photos/video to show that it did happen and when? I must have been asleep that month.
  10. fitch2000 Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    I remember seeing those vids. I think Graham Berry did the ones showing where the fence/markers w/e had been moved back. Look in the Gold raid thread.
  11. AnotherMrPink Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Does anyone think their opinion ever matters around here?
  12. ARC Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    OK look, since AO and AGP aren't here and are unable to respond on this forum I suggest that old drama just be left where it is. Go talk to them on ESMB or whatever.

    Feel free to keep discussing the current court case though.
  13. attackgypsy Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Just to play a slight Devil's Advocate

    When I was young, I worked an evidence lockup. This was many many years ago.

    Evidence was routinely destroyed. Always by a judge's order. Evidence that could be dangerous, like guns, explosives and drugs, were commonly destroyed. Other types were destroyed after cases were heard and decided. Please realize that 90%+ of cases are plead out. That means no further need for the evidence, as you give up your right of appeal when you do this.

    This may have just been a mistake. Mistakes like that happen. One number wrong, and it goes from a DVD to dynamite. Its very easy to make a mistake like that. We never cared what the evidence was or what the case was. All we cared about was "Is it dangerous for us to throw it in the incinerator?" if it was, we shipped it to a company to be disposed of.


    Now, I'm not saying that this is what happened in this case. But it is a possibility.
  14. Ann O'Nymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Very tiny.
  15. JohnnyRUClear Member

  16. Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Quoted for truth. There are many other channels in which to communicate with him directly.

    AO will not be unbanned, it's highly advised that the few posters that are clamoring for his return cease beating that dead horse.
  17. DeathHamster Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Absolutely it could be an accident, but there'd still be a papertrail of who did what on whose order, or some accounting of why folder Buttle was destroyed instead of folder Tuttle.

    If they don't have that, then they have a big problem that they'd better fix.

    Stuff like that disappears all the time when Scientology is involved, and not just in the court cases. The police file containing Toronto OG complaints made of violence, harassment and stalking against picketers turned out to be empty a few years later. Someone had completely the whole thing. Sure, it might have been an accident, but when Scientology was previously busted for infiltration and tampering with documents at the Metro Toronto Police, OPP and RCMP, well...
  18. none given Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Anyone who doubts that evidence (and other important things) are routinely discarded, destroyed or misplaced has never worked in a government building that handles tens of thousands of such things every day.
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Scientology - Above the law?
  20. ARC Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    It's true that evidence is accidentally destroyed sometimes, but it seems to be strangely common in Scientology cases. Has anybody done the math on this?
  21. Hicks Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    CHR288_Bugsy_Janitor.jpg
  22. Consensus Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Never done the math, but from thinking about it and reading this thread, I can only come to the following conclusion:

    Governments are bureaucracies, and in such bureaucracies things go missing by accident. Not all missing evidence is accidental, and Scientology has demonstrated intent and ability to destroy evidence. Evidence is missing in this case. And I lack the information necessary to determine if it was accidental or deliberate.

    And the very real possibility that it was deliberate and that evidence exists proving that keeps me intrigued; but I'm not gunna bet the farm on either the claim that it was deliberate or on evidence existing to prove that.

    If this helps take down Scientology, I'm all for it. I'm not gunna put my neck out by acting arrogant as to facts I don't actually have direct access to. I do hope the parties involved do the requisite legwork to determine the truth, or at least to determine if the truth is impossible to divine.

    /Cap'n Obvs
  23. determu Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    As promised I talked to the guy I know with a PPO (Private Patrol Operators license) he looked at the video and had several things to say.

    “IF they were hired by and paid for by the church of Scientology than they are in the clear SO LONG as they were always within the property lines.” Which from the video I believe they were on the side of the road backing up

    They had several violations of the business and professional codes of the state of California.
    Division 3
    Chapter 11.5
    CALIFORNIA BUSINESS AND PROFESSIONS CODE

    PPO “You need to subpoena their training records”
    Me ‘For what reason?’
    PPO “ Well to determine who trained them and if they had all of there permits from what I can make from the video they didn’t have one scrap of training if they worked for me I’d not only fire them I’d make sure BSIS banned them”
    Me ‘What sort of things did they do wrong’
    PPO “Well for trespassing they should of lead them off the property and called the police, I would of never let any armed guard go out with just a baton they would always have Pepper spray to show to the courts that they could go through the steps of force. Also I would of never let anyone under my command slam that 90 pound woman against that car.”

    After a half on hour of him ranting of how bad they were he did say that next year THEY WOULD HAVE TO REGISTER. And if they have to register the church would have to get insurance and keep up there training. So that means they would have to spend

    $300 a month for basic unarmed insurance (about a 1000 or more for armed)
    $45 per proper uniform *patches on the side etc.*
    $25-150 for equipment *baton pepper spray taser*
    $300 for *clearly defined security vehicles* (they would need some sort of graphic)
    One part time to full time person to do all of the paperwork
    And the church would be liable after there required half a million to million dollar insurance goes out.

    It doesn’t sound like much but it adds up and if one thing is off, if one permit isn’t filled the church is liable.

    Also with the ‘plain clothes’ guys I always see in the videos has anyone seen what company they work for or are they also hired by the church, if they are hired by the church than they would also have to register next year.
  24. DeathHamster Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    The company they work for is the Church of Scientology. They are Scientologists. They also still need to be licensed.

    One of the prev threads:
    http://forums.whyweprotest.net/291-...cos-security-goons-licensed-california-29470/
    Name of guards:
    http://forums.whyweprotest.net/249-goldbase/anon-orange-arrested-gold-base-31059/43/#post600164
  25. Anonymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    1.1 x 2.0 = LRH / DM
  26. Suzette Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Enlighten me Smurf. Where in that document does it say CalTran or some other government body can own an easement? Or does it say that the highway is not an easement at all, but owned. And why are they trying again to get the road closed? If it's public property, won't the public still be able to use it?
  27. Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Any chance of a change of venue in this case? And also, don't the city records show where property lines are, etc.?

    My 2 cents if no one said anything about this yet. (Probably did, call me a latefag, just in case...)
  28. xenubarb Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Training????

    I'm sorry, I'm still laughing...Scientologists don't need "training," they have that Whole Track thang going.

    Seriously, if you'd seen those absurd mutts trying to put flex-cuffs on AO, you'd know exactly how much training they had. It was silly, and I shared a larff about it with the Good Cop who took my report.

    Those security guards have as much "training" as I do. Which is to say, none. They are bumbling keystone kop idiots who don't have a clue on how to do anything but bully the poor inmates at Gold. Were they well trained, none of this would have happened. Lucky us! Bahahahahahaha!
  29. DeathHamster Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    They're supposed to have completed a 40 hour course, but probably flushed it from their reactive minds right afterward.
    http://forums.whyweprotest.net/291-...y-goons-licensed-california-29470/#post577095
    http://www.bsis.ca.gov/forms_pubs/guard_fact.shtml
    FLUNK!

    Besides, that's not how they do things in the Galactic Patrol.
    Heh, now why am I thinking about Front Sight right now?
  30. xenubarb Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    "Supposed to" doesn't exist in Scientology. Those keystone kops are not licensed. One of them was, iirc. I guess they expect the training to leach through to the others via osmosis, but I am betting none of them have licenses. This could prove lulzy in court...
  31. determu Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Training is just something to show in court

    imagine this

    your honor this Security guard did not have the proper training the church did not pay for it thus they should be liable for x
  32. Anonymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Hmmmm... as I recall from that video footage they were still able to toss you aside like a rag doll...
  33. CantPickaName Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    so that proves what? They know how to push and shove?
  34. ScudMuffin Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    looked more like attempted gang rape to me.
  35. Anonymous Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Puh-lease...

    If Barbz' Gang had been srsly attempting to raep the poor Scilon guards,
    I do not think they would have been able to walk away, without a serious limp.

    Attempted not-rly-surprise sechs?
    Half-hearted. Barbz' Gang does not mess around with that sort of thing.
  36. attackgypsy Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed


    Look at the size difference. XB is not a big person. And this big man tries to throw her around. Of course she's gonna go flying, dumbass.
  37. xenubarb Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Yeah. Imagine that, a 200 lb. man being able to hurl someone half his weight. That takes serious, intensive training.

    Any moar stupid observations, Captain Obvious?
  38. Uncle Bruce Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    I won’t bother to add to the non-lawyer legal analysis of the situation any more than I have in other threads. IMHO the cult is on the wrong side of this and nothing good can come of it for them. One area worth mentioning is the possibility of arrest and the need for bail. No one goes out with the expectation of being arrested but remember whom your dealing with, anything can happen. Things to consider in advance:

    Do you know the bail situation in your area? Who qualifies for ROR? What are the average amounts for minor offences? Is there an ATM at the jail? Do you have any money in your account? Who’s going to feed the cat? Are you wearing clean underwear?
  39. Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    Dude you fucking love hippies. My condolensces on taste in horror films.
  40. MeganonOT8 Member

    Re: Riverside DA: AO's evidence destroyed

    <<< This..... This I like

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