Oklahoma Doctors need help with Ibogaine research. Narconon Arrowhead

Discussion in 'Narconon' started by patriot75, Aug 3, 2012.

  1. patriot75 Member

    Ibogaine-containing preparations are used in medicinal and ritual purposes within African spiritual traditions of the Bwiti, who claim to have learned it from the Pygmy peoples. Although it was first commonly advertised as having anti-addictive properties in 1962 by Howard Lotsof, its western use predates that by at least a century. In France it was marketed as Lambarene, a medical drug used for dieting. Additionally, Freedom of Information Act documents released in the 1980s show that the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) studied the effects of ibogaine in the 1950s.[2]

    Ibogaine is an indole alkaloid that is obtained either by extraction from the iboga plant or by semi-synthesis from the precursor compound voacangine, another plant alkaloid. A full organic synthesis of ibogaine has been achieved. The synthesis process is too expensive and challenging to be used to produce a commercially significant yield, primarily due to the need to conduct the synthesis in an anoxic environment.[citation needed]
    While ibogaine's prohibition in several countries has slowed scientific research into its anti-addictive properties, the use of ibogaine for drug treatment has grown in the form of a large worldwide medical subculture.[3] Ibogaine is now used by treatment clinics in 12 countries on six continents to facilitate detoxification and relief of chemical dependence to substances such as methadone, heroin, alcohol, powder cocaine, crack cocaine, and methamphetamine, and to facilitate psychological introspection and spiritual exploration.

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    Ibogaine is metabolized in the human body by cytochrome P450 2D6, and the major metabolite is noribogaine (12-hydroxyibogamine). Noribogaine is most potent as a serotonin reuptake inhibitor and acts as a moderate κ- and weak µ-opioid receptor full agonist and therefore, also has an aspect of an opiate replacement similar to compounds like methadone. It is possible that this action of noribogaine at the kappa opioid receptor may indeed contribute significantly to the psychoactive effects attributed to ibogaine ingestion; Salvia divinorum, another plant recognized for its strong hallucinogenic properties, contains the chemical salvinorin A which is a highly selective kappa opioid agonist. Both ibogaine and noribogaine have a plasma half-life of around two hours in the rat,[41] although the half-life of noribogaine is slightly longer than the parent compound. It is proposed that ibogaine is deposited in fat and metabolized into noribogaine as it is released.[42] Noribogaine shows higher plasma levels than ibogaine and may therefore be detected for longer periods of time than ibogaine. Noribogaine is also more potent than ibogaine in rat drug discrimination assays when tested for the subjective effects of ibogaine.[43] Noribogaine differs from ibogaine in that it contains a hydroxy instead of a methoxy group at the 12 position.

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  2. patriot75 Member

    How can i clean my system out of opiates in 24 hours with home remedie?
    I have been addicted to heroin for over 15 years, and I've tried every opiate detox known to man. I ran across a substance called Ibogaine that's illegal in the US, but they offer services in Mexico. It's a complete procedure, where you go through absolutely no withdraw symptoms. If you're interested, please let me know, since I'm more involved in giving others the same gift that got me clean. If you'd like to know more, I can get you the best price possible. Just give me a call and ask for Bo 310-955-6421. If you don't want to do it in Mexico, I have underground treatment providers in the Los Angeles are that will do the procedure in a hotel room. It takes about 2 days, but when you wake up, you are not kicking at all. It's a miracle.

    Contributor: Beau
    First answer by ID1287916419. Last edit by Beau Griffis. Contributor trust: 0 [recommend contributorrecommended]. Question popularity: 4 [recommend question].
    [report abuse]

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  3. patriot75 Member
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  4. Random guy Member

    Lemme see:

    Beau Griffis is adverticing on the internet that he is selling an illegal drug in the US, doing "medical detoxification" without a license and running a whole underground nettwork?

    Eh, police?
    • Winner Winner x 7
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  5. patriot75 Member

    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. JohnnyRUClear Member

    So, who's calling them? Please state your real full name clearly, near my jacket pocket. Thanks.
  7. Anonymous Member

    I'm obviously being stupid here but what's the Narconon connection?
  8. BigBeard Member

    Should this thread be merged into the Beau Griffis mega-thread?? Just wondering.

  9. Probably should be merged.

    I am wary of him possibly 'queering the pitch' by his seemingly clandestine support for ibogaine. Groups like MAPS can tell you it is hard enough to do legitimate research in the states on certain drugs. To have some fool scilon in there muddying the waters and promoting illegal programs is hurting the cause not helping it. And I have a feeling he knows exactly what he's doing.
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  10. anon walker Moderator

    That works so well for other medical procedures carried out in hotel rooms. Injecting your ass with tire inflater, for example. Or hotel liposuction, silicone injections and other shady stuff.

    This guy needs to be exposed and busted.
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  11. Tourniquet Member

    Well, it seems that ibogaine does have some curative potential, some MDs will say great curative potential, as part of a comprehensive detox and rehab program. Naturally, this requires the attention of medical doctors prior to and during use, something a Scientologist can't have.

    BTW, just because a medication is illegal in the US, does not make it useless to more open-minded physicians in countries where it is not banned.
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  12. patriot75 Member

    Beau Griffis was Gabes roommate a at NN AH. ME office is suspicious of ibogaine being used at NN AH. The ME's office is looking deeply into ibogaine. I thought we could help them out. If Gabe's death is at the hands of Ibogaine, it would be the first documented Ibogaine death in the US.
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  13. Anonymous Member

    The difference between medicine and poison is often one of dosage. Every deadly poison kills by some mechanisms, in sublethal doses these can be exploited medically.
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  14. patriot75 Member

    I created the thread for to sole purpose of the ME and other State Authorities eyes. I wanted to make it easy for them to monitor a direct thread on Ibogaine. My apologies for splitting the threads.
  15. grebe Member

    Three articles on ibogaine in humans at PubMed, all from over a decade ago. Just observational reports involving a few patients, but these early reports did sound positive. So what is up with no clinical trials? Well Imma guess there is a reason.

    Imagine you are a small pharma company that has raised a few million for ibogaine development from investors based upon those three PubMed reports. You've formed relationships with a couple of respected addiction programs who begin using your product off label while you get an academic to put together a grant proposal for NIH funding.

    But before the proposal is ready for submission, the off label reports become concerning. Addicts are becoming tolerant to the opiate component after about four weeks so that it's like taking nothing. And you can't increase the dose without risking death due to cardiac conduction problems. Which actually happens to a couple of patients who double up their dose without realizing the danger.

    Now you have two choices:
    1. Press ahead with a clinical trial in spite of what you're seeing from preliminary, off label reports
    2. Position your product as a dietary supplement.

    If you pick #1, you will spend tens if not hundreds of millions on a study that proves that ibogaine doesn't work. That will be nice for science but bad for you.

    If you pick #2, you won't make the billions a real drug would make but you can do very well. You just have to hope that no one does any real studies demonstrating that your product doesn't actually work. So nobody doing clinical trials, that is good for you, although bad for science.

    Ok there is a 3rd choice: publish your preliminary data, cut your losses, move on.
  16. DeathHamster Member

    LOL Ibogaine!
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  17. grebe Member

    I think it would be awesome if there were a link between Narconon and ibogaine. Cuz that would indicate, to me anyway, that "the tech" is less important to the higher ups than "the money."
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  18. mama2mudbugs Member

    This. THIS. WOW! In lisenced medical staff I have read Ibogaine does wonders. However it is illegal and off to research what I can find to help!
  19. mama2mudbugs Member

    Does anyone know if Graves was on any other medications before entering rehab? Importance placed on psychiatric medications or anything for a heart condition? There are a lot of side effects to this stuff! I guess if you compare it to heroin its safer but in no means is it safe.
    Also reading that grapefruit juice has been known to cause serious reactions in those taking it along with psychiatric medications and medicines for heart conditions. I wonder if grapefruit juice is an option with their healthy eating program style offerings?

    Grave's cause of the death is "unkown". However here are a few of the side effects I found on the internet.
    The side effect profile is huge, thus the risk of taking the drug is enormous. The side effects of taking ibogaine are as follows:
    #1 Sensation of fear
    #2 Temporary short-term memory impairment
    #3 Ataxia (difficulty standing or walking)
    #4 Xerostomia (dry mouth)
    #5 Nausea and vomiting
    #6 Cardiac arrhythmias (atrial & ventricular – some potentially fatal)
    #7 Brain damage

    Hoping that helps some. It might trigger a thought or memory of something that could connect Graves with it.
  20. Anonymous Member

    Illegal is some countries does not mean illegal everywhere :)
    Under medical supervision it can do a lot of good for addicts.
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  21. Anonymous Member

    True, but there are two key phrases to your post which i think bears repeating:

    "medical supervision"

    Ibogaine seems to be a high risk drug. It can work very well, but it appears it can also not work well at all, and dosage seems critical. Prescription medicine need to have a vide zone between effective dosage and damaging dosage. Narrow zone drugs need to be kept well away from everyone but experts.
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  22. Anonymous Member

    Ibogaine is a drug people. A drug. CoS/Narconon wouldn't have anything to do with this stuff. WTF is everyone thinking?
  23. anon walker Moderator

    It appears to have remarkable potential in the right hands.
    Some stupid Scilon in a hotel room, def. not the right hands.
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  24. mama2mudbugs Member

    True. In some cases it does great things for addiction. It also kills. Many prescription drugs carry a high risk and I think its a case of benefits vs risks for each addict. HOWEVER, in many countries it is ILLEGAL. If they are using it in a country that has outlawed it, that is a drug felony charge regardless of anyone's feelings on using it as a treatment.

    It is a naturally occurring substance. Ya know ... "all natural approach to addiction..."
  25. anoninoob Member

    sooooo easy to sting. Authorities just need to call from Arizona, cross state lines for the "treatment" and FLOOOM!! Hello FBI!!
  26. Anonymous Member

    Beau Griffis is practically begging to get set up.
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  27. Random guy Member

    You mean, found as is in nature, like arsenic and asbestos? How I love the "natural is healthy" woo...
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  28. mama2mudbugs Member

    Yup, there are many dangerous natural substances out there. Cocaine comes from the coca plant.There are also great life saving natural drugs as well like aspirin. Its really a toss up ~ risks VS benefits when looking to treat addicts who are at risk for overdosing. But it is NOT a toss up in countries where its illegal.

    Also, COS is not against all drugs. They are only really interested in crushing the drugs psychologist use.

    I am not saying they are using it. It was brought up as a possibility and it was said docs needed help with ibogaine research. I am pretty sure most docs who treat addicts are familiar with it. I asked if anyone knew if Graves was taking prescription drugs before entering the rehab. it seems ibogaine reacts badly with certain prescription drugs as well as grapefruit juice.
  29. grebe Member

    There are no clinical trials at PubMed for ibogaine. That means that you can't say that ibogaine helps addicts. So stop staying that, people. Remember: Dox or GTFO.

    Do not be the cancer that is killing America, land of the wishful, home of the gullible.
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  30. Anonymous Member

    It's a miracle drug, God Bless you people for promoting it. I used to be a spiritually dead Heroin addict now with Ibogaine I'm a clean spiritual giant!
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  31. mama2mudbugs Member

    And pubmed is the end all/be all of the drug world?
    It does help many addicts. It was cleared for test trials in the US but due to money reasons it was dropped. Since you asked for DOX here is one of a billion... but rather then say DOX or GTFO, read MOAR! There are a billion medical sites concerning it.

    It is a very dangerous substance. It does work for many addicts though. It really is one of those risk/benefit things.
  32. Random guy Member

    No, but it is the end all/be all of published medical research. No PubMed record = no published research. If there's no research, how do doctors know how to use it safely? From the discussions, is seems Ibogaine may react with other medication, with debilitation or even deadly result. You want to be have that stuff used on someone except in tightly controlled medical experiments?
  33. mama2mudbugs Member

    No, I understand there are a lot of risks with it. However, I wouldn't want anyone to take Heroin either ..tightly controlled experiment or not! It is illegal in the US so should not be used to treat anything.

    However, there are been some very promising results with this drug. it is on pubmed, I checked. There are a few articles about it but here is one:

    From what I was reading the US was set to do clinical trials however the funding didn't allow for it and the trials were shut down before they even started. This was a financial issue and not a safety issue with the drug. There is no doubt that it is a serious drug with lots of risks but Methadone .. the standard in treating Heroin addiction is just as bad if not worse! Here is a quick wiki of side effects of methadone. Ibogaine has less side effects then methadone.
    If your interested you can look deeper into it then a wiki but its a fast overview of side effects.

    Its all about risks vs benefit. Any drug that treats physical addiction will be dangerous. Its the nature of the drug. Narconon's practices of extra vitamins and saunas is just as dangerous and has proven doesn't work. At least with ibogaine there seems to be a lot of positive results.
  34. grebe Member

    I know there are articles about ibogaine at PubMed. In an earlier post I mentioned that there are three observational studies of a small number of patients that looked promising.

    But we must insist that drug companies do trials with controls before sending products to market. Otherwise, they won't do them and we will never know if the product is truly safe and effective.

    All progress in medicine started about three generations ago when people began doing trials with controls. Before that we had the humoral theory of disease. Everybody thought that worked for 2,500 years.

    Drain the bad blood so the body makes new blood and people get better. That is what doctors said since before Jesus was born.
  35. Anonymous Member

    The thing is that there are all ready Numerous drugs Currently available to assist in drug withdrawl/addiction programs. In other words the tools are already available and they work, that is if you have insurance to pay for a comprehensive program and do post-treatment follow up. You sayIbogaine was cleared for "Trials" but was dropped because of financial concerns. I believe that is because the synthetic formulation which holds the most promise is cost prohibitive. Therefore if the drug industry cannot make a profit it will never see use in the USA. However we already have very successful drugs/tools to help with drug addiction withdrawals. Clonidine is an Excellent drug for opiate withdrawals which has been around since the 1950 period.
  36. mama2mudbugs Member

    Yes, but you can't put ibogaine in the same group as vitamins and saunas to treat addicts. Scientific research is promising that this drug has a positive effect with addicts. Some drugs don't work for some people. It would be good if medical staff and doctors had more options instead of if all else fails give methadone. Ibogaine is not physically addictive and that is a huge advantage to it.
  37. Anonymous Member

    What I was saying is there already are at least 15 or so drugs for drug treatment withdrawals already and they work very well. That is not including benzo's, tricyclics, MAO for dealing with the psychological aspects. They are all quite effective at treating withdrawal symptoms most centers Do Not automatically go to Methadone there are better drugs that can be used with far better end results. Methadone clinics were at one time the preferred methodology however that has not been the case for many years. Success also rides on post after the fact medical care and counseling and whether the patient has insurance many do not.
  38. grebe Member

    It is cheaper to build a house out of bricks rather than make the bricks from scratch yourself, then build the house.

    Likewise, it's sometimes cheaper to start with a compound derived from plants that is nearly the drug you want, rather than make that compound from scratch.

    tl;dr: Just because it's cheaper to use something from plants rather than make it in a lab doesn't mean drug companies won't be interested in the product.

    And contrary to some comments above, there are various ways to patent a compound in the public domain --e.g., Zenvia, a new formulation of dextromethorphan for the treatment of pseudobulbar affect.

    Number of people in the US with pseudobulbar affect: wtf, never heard of it.
    Number with addiction: a bajillion.

    Do the math. Some company will make crazy money if it brings a drug to market that helps addicts. So I am not buying the idea that ibogaine is this amazing wonder drug that nobody will fund.
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  39. Anonymous Member

    God Bless You! I continue to take it for my Spiritual well being and agree with you that it is not physically addictive.

    ps Alcohol with Ibogaine is great stuff!
  40. Anonymous Member

    It's just right now the synthetic form of this drug which has been found the most effective with less drug interactions and side effects is to expensive to bring it to market.

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