Discussion in 'Narconon' started by Intelligence, Aug 3, 2011.
The site looks wonderful Intelligence.
If I've given you anything, feel free to use my name. I want them to know I'm coming for them in Cali.
Nice site, David.
David DeMoss has revealed quite a bit about his time working for the narconobs. Anything useful for you there, David?
Link me to the info please? Thank you
Here's what David DeMoss posted here a few days ago:
Intelligence I went through the Demoss thread and in the interests of saving you from having to scan through that very messy thread, I pulled out these posts (one already linked by grebe above)
Some information from his facebook page
He arrives at WWP
Likes the Purif
Talks about ensuring adequate medical checks
His short-form sci history
Thank you for this ^^^^^
It doesn't matter what's taken with it, massive doses of niacin are going to cause problems, period.
Hubbardian quackery. "Flanking vitamins," that's a tossed out bit of crap. Practicing medicine without a license fucks up people's lives. It should be stopped, but it won't until the mother ship is dismantled, thoroughly peed upon and buried deep.
Vitamins stay in the blood stream. Adding niacin earlier or later makes no difference. There is no vitamin that "protects" against a niacin overdose. Large doses of niacin are accentuated by the hypotension caused by the high temperatures in a sauna.
Large doses of niacin require a physician's oversight.
No matter how many times the woo woo science is stated it's still bullshit.
I agree. But how do we/I get their undivided attention? Aside from chaining oneself to
the doors of government or parliament front doors (it has crossed my mind), what do/can
we do except continue on status quo? "Kick it up a notch?" I do have a few notches and upper
gears left, but not many.
A news/promoter from the USA contacted me at work today and we'll see where it goes. I monitor
our adversaries web presence all through each day and the last three days, it seems like they're
on another push,..., - - guess we'll have to push back again.
This one showed up today as well:
College of Physicians Quebec renders discipline decision concerning Narconon Trois-Rivieres physician. No fines or licence suspension, but ban on associating with Narconon stands. "After consulting experts, the College determined that Narconon Trois-Rivieres is treating patients with methods not recognized in current medical literature." Additional investigations are ongoing.
Because the College of Physicians is a private entity and not overseen by government, the Ombudsman can not be called in. However, the inquiry continues into NN TR and other COS entities "Practicing Medicine Without a Licence" is ongoing in Quebec and there is a Formal Complaint against two Physicians in Ontario who participate and promote NN TR and other Narconons.
Because Canada Health and Provincial Health Agencies are responsible financially, I will lobby these agencies.
If these pro Narconon/Purif Rundown physicians are billing our health system for pre-Purif exams, the COS physicians will have to answer to these billings.
Will be contacting politicians who oversee and are responsible for monitoring.
PRESS RELEASE within days.
happy stat day COS!
LOL,..., six (6) minutes to go before 2:00pm Thursday
I don't get it. This "medical professional" consigns vulnerable people to dangerous quackery, and all he gets is banned from associating?
Weak, man. Weak.
It's a good thing that the physician was not punished. He was the lowest man on the totem pole and Narconon would have pointed to him as the problem.
Of course the exams are being billed to the health system! A physical exam is a physical exam so I doubt the physician has to reimburse unless the physical exam was flawed. If treatment was based on the exam ( the patient was "cleared" for Purif) it's more evidence the doctor was giving substandard care. Bet you can bring this up again in another arena.
Thanks for all this work David.
The proof of medical malpractice is based on little gems like that. I'll pm you if you want help with strategy.
In Quebec, in 1976, I had to get an exam with paperwork to attend an Air Cadet course. For that I had to pay, rather than the province.
The medical profession today isn't going to fight the public, and the public want their vitamins and detox.
Quack supplements and therapies are cash money right up front for many struggling hospitals and clinics. Mr. MBA, MPH, CEO, a dynamic health systems leader with a passion for the transformation of meaningless vague language oh fuck why must I read this marketing shit, isn't going to walk away from that income stream unless he or she is made to feel ashamed for promoting nonsense to the public.
A lot of quackery has an MLM behind it. So maybe something could be done about that. MLMs are bad.
Are you referring to a Canadian example because if so I'd like some details.
Teaching hospitals in the US all have departments of quackademic medicine aka integrative medicine.
Copypasta list of some examples, one at U Alberta:
The Cleveland Clinic
The Richard and Hinda Rosenthal Center for Complementary and Alternative Medicine, Columbia University
Cornell University Center for Complementary and Integrative Medicine
The Continuum Center for Health and Healing, Albert Einstein College of Medicine of Yeshiva University
Duke Integrative Medicine
Henry Ford Health System (affiliated with the University of Michigan)
Georgetown University Medical Center (discussed here)
Harvard Medical School Osher Institute, Division for Research and Education in Complementary and Integrative Medicine
Jefferson-Myrna Brind Center of Integrative Medicine, Thomas Jefferson University
Mayo Clinic Complementary and Integrative Medicine Program
Memorial Sloan-Kettering Cancer Center
MindBody Patient Care Program, New York University
Integrative Medicine Program, Children’s Memorial Hospital (Northwestern University)
Northwestern Memorial Physicians Group Center for Integrative Medicine (Northwestern University)
Beaumont Hospitals Integrative Medicine Program, Oakland University
The Ohio State University Center for Integrative Medicine
Oregon Center for Complementary and Alternative Medicine in Neurologic Disorders, Oregon Health and Science University (Also, the OHSU Center for Women’s Health Integrative Medicine Program)
Scripps Center for Integrative Medicine
Stanford Center for Integrative Medicine
Complementary & Alternative Research and Education Program, University of Alberta (pediatrics, yet!)
University of Arizona Program in Integrative Medicine
Susan Samueli Center for Integrative Medicine, University of California, Irvine
University of California at Los Angeles Collaborative Centers for Integrative Medicine
Osher Center for Integrative Medicine, University of California, San Francisco
University of Colorado
University of Connecticut Health Center (where a “debate” about homeopathy was recently held)
Department of Integrative Medicine, Hartford Hospital, University of Connecticut
University of Maryland Center for Integrative Medicine
The Integrative Care Project, University of Kentucky Colleges of Medicine and Health Sciences
University of Massachusetts Medical School Center for Mindfulness
Institute for Complementary & Alternative Medicine, University of Medicine and Dentistry of New Jersey (UMDNJ-ICAM)
University of Michigan Medical School
University of Minnesota Center for Spirituality and Healing
University of New Mexico School of Medicine, Section of Integrative Medicine
Program on Integrative Medicine, University of North Carolina
PENNCAM, University of Pennsylvania
Center for Integrative Medicine, University of Pittsburgh Medical Center
University of Texas Medical Branch Complementary & Alternative Medicine Project
University of Texas M. D. Anderson Cancer Center Integrative Medicine Program
University of Washington School of Medicine Integrative health Program
University of Wisconsin Integrative Medicine (whose webpages seem to have been deleted but still come up when a search is done using the University web page’s search engine; what this means is unclear)
Vanderbilt Center for Integrative Health
Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center Program for Holistic and Integrative Medicine
Center for Integrative Medicine at the George Washington University Medical Center
From U Alberta link above. See if you can spot the seriously bullshitty part:
Ok I maded it bold for teh easy.
tl;dr: The plan is to get some high quality evidence for CAM therapies and products. Meanwhile, buy our vitamins and try our Reiki.
2003 was like 9 years ago. Wonder how that "high quality evidence" thing is going. Probably we'll have it ...real soon.
OMGosh grebe, I hope preparing an answer to my question didn't take you away from something important!
The reason I asked is because the medical system in Canada doesn't tend to financially reward hospitals and clinics for the provision of non-insured services, like perhaps in other countries. But thanks, I'll have a look at the Canadian example (#20, if anyone else is looking for it on grebe's list)
Reiki is scary sh*t, but seems to be accepted almost as much as TM did in its heyday. A woman I know claimed Reiki taught her how to "beam" herself through a highway tunnel at a border crossing, right after 9/11.
Out patient program is on hiatus, looks like they lost their funding http://www.care.ualberta.ca/ClinicalProgram/Outpatient Program.aspx
In-patient program is a pilot http://www.care.ualberta.ca/ClinicalProgram/Inpatient Program.aspx
I'll be interested in seeing the results of this study.
There is a list of funders/poon targets if anyone so wishes http://www.care.ualberta.ca/FundingSupport.aspx
Yeah don't hold your breath. Notice they don't even tell you what CAM therapy they're going to study.
Just Landed in Vancouver, British Columbia
USA & Canada health systems are completely different. I would be totally bald now, pulling
out my hair with having to tackle each separate State Laws. Must be a nightmare.
Narconon and the COS in Canada could not; can not; and will NOT be able to prove that the Narconon
Program is safe. In fact, the College in Quebec is well aware of the dangers. The difference in Canada/Quebec,
as compared to the USA, is that we don't have private health insurance companies. We the tax payers, pay
for ALL costs in patient care. Our health care system covers every single individual in Canada.
So if some "Snake Oil Quack" comes along and causes more harm than good, our system will put a stop to it.
AND when the Human Rights Commission, the Ministry of Health and Social Services, Canada Competition Bureau,
Revenue Canada, Canada Justice Department, and Health Canada get finished with these physicians who are also
scientologists and promote the Purif, as well as Narconon ABLE Canada, and the COS, they are going to wonder
what the hell hit them.
They may think they are untouchable and can fight off most investigations, but 2012 is going to be a year
of RECKONING for the COS CULT in Canada.
2011 was just setting the stage for battle; now it's time in 2012 for them to face Canada/Quebec Justice.
Having the Scilon physician banned was just a warm up - - time to turn up the heat - -
Yes, I too am disappoint that the Quebec College of Physicians did not penalize the Narconon T-R doctor. However, by banning him from associating with Narconon sets a precident (bad for Narconon). By extension, no physician in Quebec will be allowed to associate with Narconon's quackery. NN has effectively lost any physician validation for their program. Also its victims cannot be "medically supervised" in Quebec; they cannot be cleared for the Purif by a Quebec physician. So after thinking more about this, I'd call it a win.
Can't wait to see what happens in Ontario...
Yes, if you look at the whole picture here in Quebec, with the Ministry of Health and Social Services inquiry intowhether or not to Certify NN TR as a treatment center that meets specific regulation requirements, it's is a nice win.
ALL addiction centers in Quebec must be Certified now. With the College decision that the NN TR center does nottreat patients as per; "not recognized in current medical literature", NN TR is doomed, (in my opinion).
If the Ministry did Certify NN TR, they may be libel for any mishaps at this cult center; especially now that they arewell aware of the College decision. Andre Ahern and the COS law firm is working over time to fight us on all fronts,but since they can't adjust or squirrel the Tech, they're screwed big time. Doesn't matter how they try to "Spin" thefacts or attack me as a hate crime specialist or disgruntled employee, the facts stand firm.
I don't know why they chose Andre Ahern as their "Front Man' for all of this, his cerdibility is weak and he himself isbeing investigated.
Andre Ahern: (100% scientologist - stats man & my "Product Clearing" supervisor - patients are classed as "Products" for stats)http://www.truthaboutscientology.com/stats/by-name/a/andre-ahern.html
Looks like this was dumped: http://www.care.ualberta.ca/en/ClinicalProgram.aspx
I am looking forward to the findings. We can use them in the US when contacting sate officials. While I do get that it is from a foreign body there are some really important factors. One, it is their peers making the finding. Two, if a government body spent resources to investigate then that is a red flag that they should too. Three, if the abuse was going on there it might be going on here too, best to look in to it.
California is quite clear:
For some reason, Narconon is licensed. Is it time yet?
I have to ask, licensed what? They do not provide medical treatment of any kind so who gives them a license for detox treatment?
Oh the horror, the horror.
Somewhere in WWP there is a thread showing exactly which California official to contact but I'll be godamnned if I can find it now.
Licensed to operate as a rehab facility. All rehab facilities must be licensed by the state.
From the top;
Edmund G. Brown Jr. - Governor of California
Michael S. Cunningham - California Department of Alcohol and Drug Programs (ADP)
California Department of Alcohol and Drug Programs Contact Page
Public Records Act
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