Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by PSKL, Mar 4, 2011.
I'll be in my bunk.
A simple counter protest wherever they protest accomplishes a lot. There are three things you can point out to the public about the CCHR which turns their claims into self-damaging actions.
1) CCHR is funded and staffed by the Church of Scientology and claims to be a watchdog organization, but in reality is just a gesture of wishful thinking of Scientologists to irradicate all psychological, psychiatric, and medical practices and replace it with Scientology's practices.
2) They back up their accusations with no real data or research. It was all written by Hubbard, which further reinforces the fact that CCHR = Scientology.
3) Just look at the high claims made by the CCHR. Does this sound like an organization you want telling you to stop taking your pills?
While holding counter protests is a good idea, I also think of them as being primarily a defensive tactic to curb the growth of the CCHR's mission. There's got to be something we can do to actively work against them, even when they aren't protesting. I'm still brainstorming ideas that won't get anyone in trouble, and would be open to any suggestions.
not to sound patronizing, dude, but to make your own pursuit easier, i might suggest that you do a little research on what has already been done chanology style as regards cchr and then go from there. you'll forgive me, but going over this for the billionth time sometimes gets tiresome without what seems to be a little effort on (your) part to do that.
---research, that is.
I've done my research, but I'm shot for ideas that don't involve DDoS attacks and the like. I'm meeting another Anon this afternoon to discuss possible ideas, and hopefully we'll have something more concrete by then.
One thing that could be good would be to try to find a way to revoke the CCHR's tax exemption status, which they've had since 1993.
And no, you don't sound patronizing. You just sound like you want to make sure that the people who are trying to get an idea going are committing themselves to the task before getting others involved, which is completely reasonable.
K good. thanks.
Inoculate against them. I had a hilarious conversation with a psychology professor a while back who is now using them in her classes as an example of how not backing up your claims with documented experimentation makes you look batshit insane.
This I like. Dr. Stephen Wiseman seems to be doing just this (at least w/r/t Scientology as a whole), and the CCHR can be combated by using them as teaching materials in experimental psychology, law courses, and probably other types of classes that I haven't yet thought of.
CoS, meanwhile, can be combated through teaching about them in constitutional law, religion courses, history, social psychology, and sociology courses. The next step in getting something like this off the ground would involve developing a network of professors who care enough about the topics to integrate them into their course material.
i keep thinking that there has been some work done in this regard.
really, look around more and be patient. you'll strike a gold mine of information and intelligent ideas.
i vaguely recall in incident wherein the CCHR was protesting an annual meeting of legitimate Psychaitrists ...i think it was in Canada as well as San Francisco. and there were many videos made on this subject. also, you might look at the tons and tons of resources and see what you can extract from it. and, if you want to , you can share it here, if you think it would be helpful.
I am assuming that you do not have a background in Psychology, but one thing i think is interesting is the topic of PTSD, and the multitude of theories and treatments for Trauma. ( i say this because this is a conventional term for what Scn claims to be able to treat via auditing.)
This and the topic of Propaganda and its effects on collective sociology as regards public perception / views and choices which then affect History on a larger scale. There are a multitude of schools of thought and philosophical approaches to this as well.
but, on a more simplistic level, doing something like creating a glitzy charity ball at the Celebrity Centre for "human rights" while treating your own Sea Org staff so terribly - paying them only .50 cents an hour and not honoring the simplest Labour Laws for basic humane treatment of your own employees is full on hypocrisy in action.
This sounds quite promising. Here are some thoughts that may or may may not be helpful.
1. People help to put together a shiny and polished info package on CCHR aimed at textbook authors.
2. Identify appropriate textbook authors, their editors, and publishers.
3. The postal system works and helps people.
Marching on to work towards a Revocation of their Tax Exempt status is always a plus.
And revoking Dr. Szasz medical license would be an additional plus.
Look, there is a fine line here to consider. One does not want to "legislate" the freedom of people to their own ideas and beliefs.
I am not sure that Szasz has committed medical malpractice. I don't know.
I don't know whether he's commited medical mal practise. But let's be frank - in all likelihood there is a patient of his out there whom he treated based on Scientology understanding and somewhere it all gone wrong. We just need to find this patient.
Bozuri, Szasz is on record saying he has no connection with Scientology or their beliefs. It was Scientology who latched onto Szasz for their own ends when the CCHR was formed in the late sixties.
His arguments made a significant contribution to the field of study, which has led to positive change in the practice of psychiatry, and what used to be (but is no longer, at least not by professionals, and partly thanks to Szasz) termed 'mental illness'.
Most people on WWP will disagree, as would most in the general population. But then, most people believe all kinds of unscientific BS, don't they?
I might be wrong, but isn't he on their board? Again, I might be completely wrong with this one. I thought he was their court-psychiatrist.
Isn't he an Herro of psychiatry?
If this is what you're referring to, then you are correct, at least partially - he does serve on CCHR's Board of Advisors. Don't have any info about him being their 'court psychiatrist', but perhaps you do.
Quite possibly so. I read some articles written by other psychiatrists that were utterly unimpressed by his arguments, but since I do not specialize in the psychiatric field, it's hard for me to know who's wrong and who is right. Let me see if Dr. Stephen Wiseman said something against Szasz.
Well, serving on the board of CCHR totally constitutes being a court psychiatrist. He serves the CCHR, an organization that promotes quackery and he gives them legitimacy by being a psychiatrist with a medical degree.
I agree that it is entirely regrettable that a respected medical practitioner and academic such as Dr. Szasz finds common ground with a bunch of crooks and promoters of quackery - but stranger things have happened.
Szasz, however is sincere and honest, and just happened to find himself an opponent of a quasi-religious orthodoxy at the time he wrote his seminal works. Not all anti-psychiatry is Scientology, and psychiatry has hardly, historically speaking been immune from quackery.
Well, medicine hasn't been immune from idiotic "healing" methods. But what's quackery to me, is when scientific, emperically proven information is available, and people with agenda keep on insisting that they don't see the real data.
I agree with what you've said here...
Perhaps if he was aware of the greater abuses of Scientology and its front group, he might make a change in his choice of association with them.
1. I'll help contribute what I can to produce said materials. I majored in Economics, but have backgrounds in Psychology and Philosophy as well.
Getting textbooks published would help fight the propaganda being fed to college students through front organizations for the CoS. Getting in contact with professors from a variety of fields to discuss issues surrounding Scientology from as objective a viewpoint as manageable would be another key step to the process you outlined. It might be 4., but I"m not sure if there's another step I'm missing.
Anyone know if some people admitted to Narconon programs get government/other funding, or does it all have to come out of pocket? Trying to conceive of a master plan, here...
Vague thought, but I think that there was an instance in which they were subsidized. Some consider granting Non profit status to what may have clearly been proven to be a profit making business venture to be a form of governmental / state funding.
Anyone have any information on when/where subsidies are used for patients of Narconon?
you could also go to You Tube and search for something like, "narconon exposed" and a lot of videos will come up from all over the world.
Posting Anon in case there are any Scilons in this forum who might want to stop me from carrying out my plan:
First off, I should say that I think Narconon won't be defeated on the national level, and that I think locations will have to be picked off one by one. So I'd like to do what I can to pick off one such location.
I have mental illnesses (three diagnosed so far) and am on numerous medications for them. One of my illnesses almost universally requires medication, and my case is particularly severe. Bad, bad things can happen if I go off of them (see also: psychosis). I don't have monies and don't want to ask my parents for help, so I'm going to try to find a way to subsidize myself, and I'll admit myself to a Narconon program. I'll go through the whole program, and write a bit of Gonzo journalism, talking about what it's like to be in the facilities, what kinds of treatments are given, and what sort of indoctrination happens. Then I'll try to get the piece published in a newspaper or magazine (the larger the better). This should direct more scrutiny at the location I've selected to participate in the program, and might be the best way for me to go about trying to combat Narconon.
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