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"Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

Discussion in 'Anonymous Contre La Scientologie' started by Anonymous, Sep 1, 2009.

  1. genoramix Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    good job guise!

    et pas mal de la bombe cette emission...pas mal de trucs qui n'ont jusque la pas ou peu été abordés, et très peu de LOLXENU.

    Avec devoir d'enquete(l'emission belge) et Wise-le pouvoir caché(belge aussi) imho une des meilleures
  2. mnql1 Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    Voici les sous-titres pour la deuxième partie, c'est-à-dire 19:52-36:37 de la vidéo intégrale.

    Scientology: The Mystery of the Missing Files
    (Scientologie: Le mystère des dossiers disparus)

    Part 2 of 3

    Link to Part 1

    Link to Part 3

    Link to video in French

    A report first broadcast in French on the program Enquêtes criminelles on Wednesday, September 2, 2009 on the W9 network in France.

    Fabio Amicarelli, European Church of Scientology official
    Daniel, Former follower
    Jean-Pierre Brard, Deputy, author of a report on sects
    Marie-Alix Canu-Bernard, Attorney for Marie-Paule Moracchini
    Julia Darcondo, Former follower
    Nicolay Fakiroff, Attorney for former followers
    Serge Faubert, Author of "Une secte au coeur de la république" ("A Sect at the Heart of the Republic")
    Alain Gest, Deputy (UMP), author of a report on sects
    Danièle Gounord, Scientology spokesperson
    Didier Lerouge, Former follower
    Marie-Paule Moracchini, Judge
    Olivier Morice, Attorney for former followers
    Jean-Michel Pesenti, Attorney for former followers


    Narrator
    19:53.02-19:54.08 This affair made a lot of noise
    19:54.64-19:55.91 and left everyone wondering
    19:55.95-20:00.12 how Danièle Gounord managed to obtain such a privileged seat.
    Interviewer
    20:00.72-20:02.41 Interviewer: Is it easy to obtain an invitation?
    Alain Gest
    20:02.45-20:03.38 No.
    20:03.86-20:05.44 To obtain an invitation to the public gallery?
    20:05.47-20:06.67 Yes.
    20:06.71-20:08.65 To obtain an invitation for those seats?
    20:08.69-20:09.85 No, of course.
    20:09.89-20:15.51 So there is no reason for any person,
    20:15.55-20:17.99 except with formal authorization by a minister,
    20:18.04-20:19.68 to be in that location.
    Narrator
    20:20.36-20:22.92 The National Assembly conducted an investigation.
    20:23.36-20:24.12 In vain.
    20:24.74-20:26.21 No one will ever know
    20:26.24-20:29.75 how Danièle Gounord could have been granted such an invitation.
    20:30.41-20:33.58 We asked the Scientology spokesperson to explain this.
    20:33.90-20:35.85 Her answer was, to say the least, cryptic.
    Danièle Gounord
    20:36.39-20:38.49 I didn't realize that I was in a ministerial gallery,
    20:38.54-20:39.74 when I was in there, if you will,
    20:39.80-20:40.71 I didn't even realize.
    20:41.19-20:42.20 I just thought, "I'm in good position."
    20:42.25-20:43.61 "Wonderful! I'm in a good position."
    20:44.07-20:45.03 So that's it.
    20:45.07-20:47.08 I was in a good position and I felt very appreciative.
    Interviewer
    20:47.51-20:49.30 Interviewer: But the feeling at the National Assembly was less appreciative.
    Danièle Gounord
    20:51.60-20:53.02 Too bad for them. I mean ...
    20:53.06-20:54.04 That's it.
    20:55.38-20:56.52 I find that it was very funny.
    20:56.56-20:57.69 It was very, very funny and ...
    20:59.10-21:01.08 All things considered, it really happened by chance.
    21:01.49-21:03.50 Someone gave a seat to someone,
    21:03.57-21:05.10 who gave the seat to someone else,
    21:05.16-21:06.01 who gave it to me.
    21:06.05-21:07.13 That's all. End of story.
    Jean-Pierre Brard
    21:09.49-21:15.48 I don't put much stock in the shaggy dog story we were given,
    21:15.98-21:18.43 that it was an agent of the National Assembly
    21:18.46-21:23.87 who had requested an invitation and then passed it along
    21:23.93-21:25.89 to the cousin of an aunt of so-and-so ...
    21:25.93-21:29.38 thereby allowing Madame Gounord to find herself,
    21:29.44-21:30.99 by an act of the Holy Spirit,
    21:31.02-21:32.20 in that gallery.
    Narrator
    21:33.15-21:35.23 On that day, thanks to Danièle Gounord,
    21:35.27-21:38.55 Scientology delivered an incredible demonstration
    21:38.62-21:41.24 of its strength and power.
    Alain Gest
    21:41.40-21:44.63 Scientology has an organizational capability
    21:44.66-21:47.79 and power that allows it to do ...
    21:47.82-21:49.85 I was about to say, practically whatever it wants.
    Jean-Pierre Brard
    21:49.89-21:51.81 ... and to prove that it can be
    21:51.93-21:53.88 wherever it wants, whenever it wants.
    21:54.01-21:59.36 And I trust its know-how and its secret service
    21:59.39-22:03.28 to have obtained what was needed, when it was needed.
    Narrator
    22:03.96-22:07.51 This episode at the National Assembly reignited an old debate:
    22:08.20-22:09.68 Is the Church of Scientology
    22:09.72-22:12.19 a sect with infiltrations at all levels of the State?
    22:12.78-22:16.64 The mysterious disappearance, at the Palais de justice in Paris,
    22:16.88-22:18.78 of part of a case file
    22:18.82-22:20.63 might lead one to think so.

    22:24.86-22:27.07 THE PHANTOM OF THE COURTHOUSE

    Narrator
    22:31.46-22:32.88 At the Palais de justice in Paris,
    22:33.53-22:34.93 on this floor,
    22:35.25-22:38.19 the corridors leading to the offices of the investigating judges
    22:38.63-22:41.10 are closely monitored by gendarmes.
    22:42.57-22:45.21 So no one would have imagined that, in this location,
    22:45.66-22:47.90 files concerning an ongoing judicial investigation
    22:48.26-22:49.49 were going to evaporate.
    Serge Faubert
    22:49.50-22:50.83 Then there's another bizarre thing.
    22:50.87-22:53.37 Something extraordinary, that never happens --
    22:53.41-22:54.85 but with Scientology, it happens --
    22:54.89-22:56.79 part of the case file disappeared.
    Narrator
    22:57.61-23:00.06 Attention fell upon Judge Marie-Paule Moracchini.
    23:01.13-23:03.85 Everyone wondered how this judge could have lost
    23:03.87-23:05.41 or been robbed of
    23:05.46-23:07.18 a portion of a case file.
    23:07.72-23:10.11 The general opinion regarding this magistrate,
    23:10.15-23:12.20 who is very well rated by her superiors,
    23:12.24-23:14.59 is that she is not reputed to be careless.
    Nicolay Fakiroff
    23:14.67-23:16.40 She's a competent judge,
    23:16.56-23:18.55 and she doesn't have a reputation for being
    23:18.59-23:24.42 a negligent or intellectually dishonest judge.
    Narrator
    23:25.02-23:28.11 And yet this woman, apparently above all suspicion,
    23:28.15-23:31.51 would find herself at the heart of a real judicial scandal.
    23:33.15-23:35.18 It all began in 1989.
    23:35.97-23:39.04 Marie-Paule Moracchini inherited the Scientology case.
    23:39.94-23:41.03 As required by procedure,
    23:41.07-23:42.97 she worked in close collaboration
    23:42.97-23:44.87 with specialized police officers.
    23:45.30-23:47.10 Their work was exemplary.
    Jean-Michel Pesenti
    23:47.69-23:50.17 These investigators conducted a full investigation.
    23:51.11-23:54.64 They conducted searches, they heard the witnesses,
    23:54.68-23:57.59 they heard the future defendants,
    23:57.63-23:58.85 they heard the victims.
    Narrator
    23:59.64-24:01.26 In 1993,
    24:01.31-24:03.15 after 4 years of investigation,
    24:03.55-24:05.74 Inspector Biagiotti delivered his conclusions
    24:05.81-24:07.02 to the investigating judge.
    24:08.07-24:09.76 For him, there was no doubt.
    24:10.24-24:13.84 The Church of Scientology should be tried in court.
    Quotation from document
    24:14.26-24:17.72 "Charges of extortion of funds and illegal practice of medicine"
    24:17.75-24:19.52 "can apparently be retained"
    24:19.57-24:21.51 "against the Church of Scientology."
    Narrator
    24:23.30-24:26.90 Inspector Biagiotti's report was unequivocal.
    24:27.43-24:30.87 For him, there were grounds to prosecute the accused
    24:31.47-24:33.90 and take action to have them one day stand before a court.
    24:35.05-24:36.04 But there was a problem.
    24:36.12-24:38.53 This was not at all the opinion of the investigating judge.
    24:39.58-24:41.59 Against all expectations, Marie-Paule Moracchini
    24:41.65-24:43.71 did not base her decision on the police report.
    24:44.24-24:47.67 She decided not to send Scientology to court.
    24:48.37-24:51.91 This decision surprised everyone interested in this case.
    Serge Faubert
    24:55.72-24:58.40 Why not send the case to trial?
    24:59.32-25:01.86 Why was Judge Moracchini holding up the case?
    Jean-Michel Pesenti
    25:02.19-25:03.86 The case was quite solid,
    25:04.10-25:07.88 a quite classic case of financial crime and fraud.
    25:07.92-25:09.74 I fail to see why a magistrate
    25:09.80-25:11.24 could have had a doubt about this,
    25:11.27-25:13.20 in comparison with other financial cases.
    Narrator
    25:14.21-25:16.37 Today, through her attorney,
    25:16.41-25:18.31 Marie-Paule Moracchini explains
    25:18.35-25:20.93 why she did not heed the recommendation of the police.
    Marie-Alix Canu-Bernard
    25:21.61-25:23.68 It does not follow, just because a police officer says,
    25:23.72-25:25.79 "I believe fraud can be proven,"
    25:25.85-25:27.03 that it is proven.
    25:27.38-25:30.19 She considers, as a jurist, as a magistrate,
    25:30.23-25:31.51 an investigating magistrate,
    25:31.63-25:35.18 that the facts do not constitute a case, legally.
    25:35.38-25:37.20 It's her discretionary power.
    25:37.24-25:39.49 It's her role, it's under her responsibility.
    Narrator
    25:40.28-25:42.38 Marie-Paule Moracchini considered that there were
    25:42.46-25:45.47 insufficient grounds on which to prosecute Scientology in court.
    25:46.26-25:47.57 This is her right.
    25:48.24-25:51.46 But why then did the judge not dismiss the case,
    25:51.70-25:54.35 thus allowing the sect to avoid a trial?
    Marie-Alix Canu-Bernard
    25:54.46-25:55.47 Which would be better?
    25:55.51-25:56.47 To dismiss the case quickly
    25:56.51-26:00.33 with the victims never recovering their money?
    26:01.12-26:03.26 Or is it better to wait,
    26:04.38-26:07.12 let the parties work things out with one another,
    26:07.16-26:11.22 as they reconcile by financial means,
    26:12.73-26:14.07 and then close the case
    26:14.11-26:17.79 once everyone has recovered their money?
    Narrator
    26:18.90-26:19.98 In reality, at that time,
    26:20.02-26:21.83 Marie-Paule Moracchini knew
    26:21.86-26:23.60 that Scientology was trying at all costs
    26:23.66-26:25.09 to negotiate with the plaintiffs.
    26:27.73-26:30.00 This was the case for Julia and Daniel,
    26:30.02-26:31.76 former followers.
    26:32.04-26:34.01 Both were contacted by the sect
    26:34.04-26:36.16 with an offer of money for the withdrawal of their complaint.
    Daniel
    26:37.29-26:39.79 I was contacted by Scientology for a proposed settlement.
    Interviewer
    26:40.00-26:41.49 Interviewer: Meaning ... ?
    Daniel
    26:41.53-26:43.40 Well, they said they were ready,
    26:43.43-26:45.09 but that it had to be done very quickly,
    26:45.14-26:49.35 to refund all the money I had spent on Scientology.
    Julia Darcondo
    26:49.47-26:52.88 I was given an appointment that took place in a small café.
    26:52.92-26:54.52 She told me, "We agree."
    26:54.56-26:57.07 "This matter will be resolved."
    Narrator
    26:57.94-27:00.73 Scientology was ready to spend a lot of money.
    27:01.26-27:03.26 At that time, 500,000 francs [76,200 euros] for Julia
    27:03.66-27:05.60 and close to 200,000 francs [29,100 euros] for Daniel,
    27:05.64-27:07.47 if both were to withdraw their complaint.
    Julia Darcondo
    27:08.03-27:12.55 They are the ones who gave me the text of the renunciation.
    Daniel
    27:12.71-27:14.65 So he appended to the settlement
    27:14.65-27:16.60 a model for a letter that had to be copied by hand
    27:16.64-27:18.55 and sent to the investigating judge
    27:18.59-27:21.47 and which said that the complaint was to be withdrawn.
    Narrator
    27:22.09-27:24.11 This is the letter of withdrawal,
    27:24.15-27:25.95 which had to be handwritten
    27:25.99-27:28.10 and sent by the plaintiffs to Marie-Paule Moracchini
    27:28.46-27:30.33 once the settlement was concluded.
    Quotation from letter
    27:33.58-27:36.08 "I hereby inform you that I have resolved the misunderstanding"
    27:36.12-27:38.66 "which existed between the Church of Scientology and myself."
    27:42.09-27:45.84 "I desist from any action against them and withdraw my complaint."
    Narrator
    27:48.27-27:51.24 Julia and Daniel both refused to sign this letter.
    27:52.36-27:53.64 During this period,
    27:53.68-27:56.35 Marie-Paule Moracchini received tens of letters
    27:56.38-27:58.96 from former followers who withdrew their complaint.
    27:59.47-28:01.59 The case she was investigating became weaker.
    28:02.03-28:03.47 There would soon be no grounds
    28:03.50-28:04.79 on which to prosecute the Scientologists,
    28:05.46-28:06.56 all the more since, apparently,
    28:06.84-28:09.34 the judge may have favored these settlements
    28:09.38-28:11.59 between the sect and the former followers.
    Didier Lerouge
    28:11.79-28:13.69 It was in her office that she asked me,
    28:14.13-28:16.14 "If Scientology refunds you 500,000 francs,"
    28:16.18-28:17.53 "will you withdraw your complaint?"
    28:18.21-28:19.39 And I answered,
    28:19.39-28:21.19 "Yes, if they refund me 500,000 francs,"
    28:21.23-28:22.56 "I will withdraw my complaint,"
    28:22.60-28:24.53 "but this won't prevent me from testifying"
    28:24.57-28:26.78 "and continuing to say that Scientologists are swindlers."
    Narrator
    28:27.51-28:29.18 For the plaintiffs’ attorneys,
    28:29.22-28:32.18 Marie-Paule Moracchini had overstepped her role
    28:32.25-28:33.88 as an investigating judge.
    Jean-Michel Pesenti
    28:34.59-28:36.46 The work of a judge is not to intervene,
    28:36.52-28:38.23 and has never been to intervene,
    28:38.29-28:39.65 in potential settlements.
    28:39.72-28:42.22 It is not to favor a settlement.
    28:42.26-28:43.29 It is not to say to a victim,
    28:43.33-28:44.67 "You know, it would be better to settle."
    28:44.71-28:45.90 "It would take less time"
    28:45.94-28:48.05 "and there might be less risk"
    28:48.09-28:50.61 "of you not receiving compensation someday."
    Narrator
    28:50.93-28:53.34 Scientology negotiated with the plaintiffs
    28:53.40-28:54.95 and, astonishingly,
    28:54.98-28:57.37 the investigating judge allowed it.
    28:57.71-29:00.04 As a result, the investigation remained at a standstill.
    29:00.82-29:02.25 At the Palais de justice in Paris,
    29:02.28-29:05.50 Marie-Paule Moracchini's attitude was criticized,
    29:05.94-29:09.80 especially after one event which discredited her reputation.
    29:11.46-29:15.27 On October 12, 1998 came the stunning news.
    29:16.12-29:18.95 Of the 10 volumes concerning the Scientology case,
    29:19.04-29:23.11 one volume and a half had vanished.
    Serge Faubert
    29:23.78-29:26.03 It's conceivable to lose an entire volume of the case file,
    29:26.11-29:28.02 which is a set of folders that have sheets inside
    29:28.09-29:29.39 and are closed by a strap.
    29:29.43-29:31.08 A folder can fall on the floor and end up
    29:31.10-29:32.90 under a radiator or on top of a cabinet.
    29:32.92-29:33.78 I can picture that.
    29:33.86-29:40.91 But it appears that half of one volume was also lost.
    29:41.09-29:45.33 This means that elements were taken from inside the folder
    29:45.35-29:47.78 and that someone then closed the folder.
    29:48.76-29:51.27 For sheets to be out of a folder,
    29:51.33-29:52.71 someone must've removed them.
    29:53.28-29:54.79 So to characterize as accidental
    29:54.83-29:57.41 the disappearance of this half-volume
    29:57.45-30:00.42 would leave me skeptical.
    Nicolay Fakiroff
    30:00.74-30:04.88 Plainly, a disappearance occurred,
    30:04.91-30:09.01 which resulted from a malevolent action,
    30:09.03-30:11.01 or, at any rate, deliberate malice.
    Narrator
    30:11.80-30:15.26 And immediately, all eyes turned to Marie-Paule Moracchini,
    30:15.99-30:18.05 Her lack of rigor was criticized.
    30:18.53-30:20.78 An internal investigation was launched against her.
    30:24.33-30:26.94 The matter instantly became political.
    30:27.39-30:28.50 At the Assembly,
    30:28.66-30:30.46 the Justice Minister at that time,
    30:30.50-30:33.14 Elisabeth Guigou, addressed the issue.
    Elisabeth Guigou, Minister of Justice, June 22, 2000
    30:37.99-30:42.47 I ordered an investigation by the Judicial Inspection Unit.
    30:43.18-30:45.64 It concluded that the most probable explanation
    30:45.68-30:48.50 is that the disappearance of the files is a fraudulent offense.
    30:49.43-30:52.77 I will very quickly make a decision
    30:52.80-30:56.29 about possible disciplinary measures.
    Narrator
    30:57.36-31:00.96 What could have been the content of the missing volume and a half?
    31:01.56-31:03.65 And who could have had an interest in stealing it?
    31:04.03-31:06.41 No one has ever been able to answer these questions.
    31:10.72-31:12.34 At the end of the proceedings against her,
    31:12.38-31:15.36 Marie-Paule Moracchini was declared innocent by her peers.
    News anchorman, December 13, 2001
    31:18.68-31:20.40 Judge Marie-Paule Moracchini
    31:20.44-31:23.24 has been exonerated by the High Council on the Judiciary.
    Marie-Paule Morrachini, December 13, 2001
    31:24.65-31:26.02 It's the end of the nightmare.
    31:26.10-31:27.97 We have a clear decision
    31:28.01-31:29.85 saying that I committed no error
    31:29.89-31:33.01 which would justify any prosecution against me.
    Narrator
    31:33.78-31:35.02 The judge was exonerated,
    31:35.47-31:36.54 but suspicions of theft
    31:36.58-31:39.12 inside the Palais de justice itself remained.
    31:40.85-31:42.23 The question on all minds was
    31:42.26-31:43.49 who was profiting from this crime?
    31:44.22-31:46.28 Because the disappearance of part of the case file
    31:46.30-31:48.69 threatened to compromise the holding of a trial,
    31:49.53-31:52.58 an outcome that would suit the Church of Scientology.
    Olivier Morice
    31:54.62-31:56.97 Who profits from this dysfunctionality?
    31:58.22-31:59.44 Scientologists.
    31:59.92-32:01.35 It is perfectly known
    32:01.39-32:04.52 that Scientology practices infiltration,
    32:05.45-32:10.20 and tries to use all possible means
    32:10.23-32:13.95 to put an end to such judicial investigations.
    Narrator
    32:15.16-32:17.28 In response to this accusation, the Church of Scientology
    32:17.71-32:20.18 has always denied any responsibility
    32:20.18-32:22.73 in the disappearance of a volume and a half of the case file.
    32:25.24-32:29.46 Yet today, a police inspector says he is convinced of the contrary.
    32:30.00-32:32.46 For the first time, he agreed to speak with us
    32:32.50-32:34.33 about the, to say the least, dubious methods
    32:34.37-32:36.35 to which the sect might resort
    32:36.39-32:38.21 and which are described in a document
    32:38.71-32:39.83 that we obtained,
    32:40.37-32:42.33 entitled "The Strike",
    32:42.37-32:43.37 in French, "The Attack".
    Anonymous former police officer
    32:43.45-32:45.16 "The Strike" was written to,
    32:45.48-32:50.18 in effect, train Scientologists to become perfect thieves.
    Narrator
    32:51.25-32:53.13 And here is what the document says.
    32:53.95-32:59.01 It describes "A walk in ... a government building".
    33:05.79-33:10.63 “You should have a story already made up that will be plausible"
    33:10.65-33:14.51 "should you be asked what you are doing”.
    Anonymous former police officer
    33:15.80-33:19.17 “The Strike” explains how to gain access to a building,
    33:19.21-33:22.12 to enter the targeted offices within this building,
    33:22.16-33:24.65 and how, once inside the offices,
    33:24.68-33:26.12 to collect information.
    Narrator
    33:27.27-33:29.42 This 5-page document has all the appearance
    33:29.49-33:31.11 of a manual for the perfect thief,
    33:31.62-33:33.85 and explains, for instance,
    33:33.87-33:35.95 how to make compromising files disappear.
    33:37.02-33:37.87 Everything is thought out:
    33:41.05-33:44.94 “anything that protects the agent"
    33:45.41-33:48.67 for example, "wearing squeakless shoes,"
    33:49.27-33:50.94 and "carrying a large purse or attaché"
    33:51.01-33:54.17 for "carrying target info”
    33:54.20-33:57.11 so that “he is not questioned about its contents”.
    33:59.65-34:01.02 Nothing is left to chance.
    34:01.62-34:03.91 To guarantee the success of a mission,
    34:03.95-34:05.84 the document recommends that followers
    34:05.88-34:07.83 be particularly cautious.
    34:08.52-34:11.18 “[You should know] guards making security rounds,"
    34:11.20-34:13.44 "locked cabinets,"
    34:13.48-34:17.76 "maintenance personnel after working hours,"
    34:17.80-34:21.49 "closed circuit TV cameras, and alarm systems ...”
    34:22.26-34:23.64 According to our information,
    34:23.68-34:25.84 “The Strike” remains in effect to this day.
    34:27.67-34:30.88 This document shows to what extent Scientology may be
    34:30.91-34:33.43 one of the best-organized sectarian organizations
    34:33.46-34:34.46 whatsoever.
    34:34.92-34:35.85 But in spite of everything,
    34:35.89-34:37.52 nothing has ever allowed anyone to prove
    34:37.56-34:39.07 that a member of the sect
    34:39.11-34:41.76 slipped into the Palais de justice in Paris
    34:42.36-34:45.23 to steal or delete essential information
    34:45.73-34:47.01 concerning an ongoing investigation.
    34:55.55-34:58.61 In May 2003, the investigation into the disappearance
    34:58.65-35:00.54 of exhibits from the Scientology case file
    35:00.58-35:02.73 in the corridors of the Palais de justice in Paris
    35:03.49-35:05.24 ended in dismissal.
    35:05.86-35:08.15 No explanation will ever be put forward
    35:08.19-35:10.76 to shed light on what today is still being called
    35:11.12-35:12.45 a judicial enigma.
    35:13.86-35:15.37 In November 2005,
    35:15.41-35:17.35 the French State was condemned to pay
    35:17.39-35:19.67 6,000 euros in damages and interest to Scientologists
    35:19.71-35:22.37 for miscarriage of justice.
    Serge Faubert
    35:24.30-35:26.85 The gods of Scientology must exist,
    35:27.97-35:31.57 because, frankly, I must say, the Church of Scientology,
    35:31.61-35:32.90 as far as the justice system is concerned,
    35:33.14-35:35.76 has amazing luck.
    35:36.00-35:37.24 Amazing.
    Narrator
    35:38.67-35:40.60 But this luck might finally be changing.
    35:41.37-35:44.35 A new legal episode began for Scientology
    35:44.38-35:46.18 on May 25 this year [2009] in Paris.
    35:46.73-35:50.69 On that day, as a result of complaints by 2 former members,
    35:50.72-35:53.69 a trial began against 6 officials of the sect
    35:53.72-35:55.86 for organized fraud.
    35:56.61-35:58.68 For this occasion, Scientology brought in
    35:58.72-36:01.38 some of its most important members.
    Fabio Amicarelli
    36:03.56-36:05.82 This is an inquisition, not even a trial,
    36:05.88-36:08.71 [as in] Torquemada’s times,
    36:08.77-36:12.26 and I think that what is being tried to do here is that
    36:12.32-36:15.59 you destroy the freedom of thought, the freedom of belief,
    36:15.65-36:17.40 of the French people here.
    36:17.44-36:18.95 It's not just for Scientology.
    36:19.06-36:21.26 This is what is happening in Paris now.
    Narrator
    36:22.15-36:24.67 And if this trial is taken seriously
    36:24.70-36:25.99 by the Church of Scientology,
    36:26.05-36:29.34 the reason is that it's also being judged as a legal entity.
    36:29.84-36:31.21 Given its past 4 convictions,
    36:31.25-36:33.29 it is risking dissolution in France.
    36:34.00-36:36.55 The judgment will be announced on October 27, 2009.
  3. Ann O'Nymous Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    Super. Merci.
  4. mnql1 Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    Voici les sous-titres pour la troisième et dernière partie, c'est-à-dire 36:37-52:51 de la vidéo intégrale.

    Merci à Ann O'Nymous et à Olrik pour leur collaboration.

    Scientology: The Mystery of the Missing Files
    (Scientologie: Le mystère des dossiers disparus)

    Part 3 of 3

    Link to Part 1

    Link to Part 2

    Link to video in French

    A report first broadcast in French on the program Enquêtes criminelles on Wednesday, September 2, 2009 on the W9 network in France.

    Sidonie Bonnec, Co-host of Enquêtes criminelles
    Paul Lefèvre, Co-host of Enquêtes criminelles
    Georges Fenech, Chairman of MIVILUDES
    Alain Stoffen, Former follower and author of "Journey to the Heart of Scientology"


    Sidonie Bonnec
    36:38.66-36:40.96 Sidonie Bonnec: This documentary is by Valérie Montmartin.
    36:41.00-36:42.64 With us in the studio, we have 2 guests.
    36:42.68-36:43.79 Good evening.
    36:43.83-36:47.71 Alain Stoffen, you are a former Scientology follower.
    36:47.75-36:49.83 You describe your experience in a book
    36:49.83-36:51.91 which has just been published by Éditions Privé.
    36:51.95-36:54.62 The title is "Journey to the Heart of Scientology".
    36:54.74-36:55.64 Thank you for being here.
    36:55.92-36:57.46 Next to you is Georges Fenech. Good evening.
    36:57.50-36:58.71 Good evening.
    36:58.79-36:59.62 You are the chairman of MIVILUDES,
    36:59.66-37:01.83 the Interministerial Mission of Vigilance and Combat
    37:01.87-37:03.05 against Sectarian Aberrations.
    37:03.09-37:05.27 You are a former deputy, a former investigating judge.
    37:05.33-37:06.61 Thank you also for being here.
    37:07.22-37:08.34 First question.
    37:08.38-37:11.11 Is Scientology really risking dissolution?
    Georges Fenech
    37:11.63-37:14.02 Ah, yes. The prosecution requested it.
    37:16.06-37:18.22 There is independence of the court
    37:18.26-37:20.38 with respect to the prosecution’s request,
    37:20.90-37:24.79 but this is a real sword of Damocles over its head.
    37:25.46-37:28.88 So does this mean that Scientology could disappear
    37:28.90-37:29.66 and no longer exist?
    Paul Lefèvre
    37:29.74-37:31.07 Paul Lefèvre: Legally speaking.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    37:31.11-37:32.07 Bonnec: Legally speaking.
    Georges Fenech
    37:32.11-37:34.35 Fenech: That is another matter.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    37:32.11-37:34.35 Bonnec: Please explain.
    Georges Fenech
    37:34.39-37:38.17 Because the Church of Scientology is not a single entity.
    37:38.82-37:41.20 It consists of different Dianetics centers
    37:41.24-37:42.08 throughout France
    37:42.11-37:43.80 with separate legal structures.
    37:44.18-37:47.24 So if you order the dissolution of the Paris organization,
    37:47.83-37:50.75 this will not have consequences
    37:50.78-37:54.11 for those in Lyon, Marseilles, Angers, Saint-Étienne…
    37:54.14-37:55.37 which will continue to exist.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    37:55.41-37:57.81 So structures would be dissolved, but not Scientology, the church.
    Georges Fenech
    37:57.85-37:58.81 Fenech: Correct.
    37:59.49-38:03.19 So we would be in a situation, if dissolution is the outcome,
    38:04.00-38:07.13 a quite surprising situation,
    38:07.60-38:09.69 where Scientology can no longer be practiced in Paris,
    38:10.44-38:13.77 but continues in Lyon, Marseille, and Saint-Étienne.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    38:13.81-38:16.96 Can the Church of Scientology really be banned, legally?
    Georges Fenech
    38:18.89-38:21.14 Uh, ... yes. In my opinion, yes,
    38:21.18-38:25.11 but such a measure would, I'd say, be of a political nature,
    38:25.15-38:27.02 not simply judicial,
    38:28.23-38:31.91 and would suppose the issuing of general instructions
    38:32.08-38:33.28 by the Minister of Justice.
    Paul Lefèvre
    38:33.32-38:35.76 And this would raise issues concerning freedom of thought
    38:35.80-38:39.35 and other organizations with parallels to Scientology.
    38:39.39-38:43.27 It's not the only organization that's considered sectarian.
    38:44.39-38:47.89 At any rate, this will be much discussed in the near future,
    38:47.93-38:50.75 because, first, there is this trial,
    38:50.78-38:52.49 which will be followed by an appeal,
    38:52.53-38:54.35 quite probably up to the Court of Cassation.
    38:54.39-38:57.93 Then there will be Mr. Stoffen's case,
    38:57.97-39:00.78 and a third case which is presently ongoing --
    39:00.82-39:01.84 just to mention cases in Paris.
    39:02.01-39:05.65 So we will have at least one year to reflect --
    39:05.85-39:07.89 this is perhaps what's most interesting --
    39:07.93-39:12.32 to reflect on the problems raised by the Church of Scientology.
    39:12.86-39:15.44 So during one year, there will be new developments,
    39:15.48-39:17.01 the press will follow these developments --
    39:17.05-39:18.71 with more or less success,
    39:18.75-39:19.71 more or less pushed by
    39:19.75-39:21.53 or more or less slowed by the Church of Scientology --
    39:21.57-39:22.76 but let's put that aside.
    39:22.81-39:23.91 So for at least one year,
    39:23.95-39:29.37 we will be thinking about whether it's an association
    39:29.41-39:31.05 that allows people to believe
    39:31.09-39:32.95 and to elevate themselves spiritually
    39:33.53-39:38.63 or is it an organized fraud ring -- that's one theory --
    39:39.34-39:43.36 made up of people whose only purpose
    39:43.36-39:47.38 is to empty the bank accounts of their unfortunate victims?
    Sidonie Bonnec
    39:48.02-39:50.33 Despite all these cases, it seems that the Church of Scientology
    39:50.37-39:53.75 always manages to evade justice.
    Georges Fenech
    39:55.24-39:57.98 It has always come out well, you are right,
    39:58.05-40:04.80 since it is perfectly able, because it has the resources --
    Sidonie Bonnec
    40:05.20-40:05.99 Bonnec: The financial means.
    Georges Fenech
    40:05.20-40:05.99 Fenech: Yes.
    40:06.23-40:09.25 ... the financial means to hire very good lawyers,
    40:10.37-40:12.47 to use every possible recourse,
    40:12.51-40:17.54 and it has a tremendous capability for propaganda.
    40:18.74-40:20.29 It attracts and continues to attract
    40:20.31-40:21.87 a certain number of people.
    Paul Lefèvre
    40:21.91-40:22.87 Lefèvre: And it slips through the cracks.
    Georges Fenech
    40:22.91-40:24.51 It's present everywhere.
    Paul Lefèvre
    40:24.55-40:28.21 Lefèvre: In training programs and things like that.
    Georges Fenech
    40:28.25-40:29.37 Fenech: Here's an example.
    40:29.85-40:34.50 This year, an organization that depends on
    40:34.56-40:35.61 the Church of Scientology --
    40:35.64-40:36.77 but we're not supposed to know this --
    40:36.81-40:39.68 called the Citizens Commission on Human Rights,
    40:40.11-40:41.46 with a nice logo,
    40:41.46-40:43.11 which gives the impression that
    40:43.15-40:45.23 it's the National Consultative Commission on Human Rights --
    40:45.27-40:46.45 you see, they play on confusion --
    40:47.71-40:49.92 This organization managed to dupe 80 deputies,
    40:50.60-40:54.63 who sent questions in writing to the Minister of Health
    40:55.37-40:58.76 to demand explanations about the abuse of psychiatric internments.
    40:59.48-41:02.20 We, MIVILUDES, the mission of which I am chairman,
    41:02.24-41:04.08 had to alert the public authorities,
    41:04.08-41:05.61 the Ministry of Health, the deputies,
    41:05.65-41:07.48 telling them: "Beware! These are not questions"
    41:07.52-41:09.13 "from the National Commission on Human Rights."
    41:09.18-41:10.50 "These are questions from an organization"
    41:10.52-41:12.33 "that depends on the Church of Scientology."
    41:12.41-41:16.25 This shows their ability to infiltrate here and there
    41:16.40-41:17.95 and to sow confusion.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    41:18.15-41:20.52 Alain Stoffen, you are a former follower,
    41:20.55-41:22.44 a former disciple, as you've said.
    41:22.47-41:25.42 How did you join the Church of Scientology?
    Alain Stoffen
    41:25.46-41:29.45 To be very specific,I was offered a first course,
    41:29.49-41:30.45 a short one,
    41:31.35-41:32.63 called a "communication course".
    41:32.67-41:35.60 There is a whole range of what they call "introductory courses",
    41:35.88-41:38.06 which are extremely interesting, very short,
    41:38.12-41:39.10 very inexpensive,
    41:39.82-41:44.07 and which produce results quite rapidly.
    41:44.11-41:45.48 So I did ...
    41:45.53-41:48.80 It cost me 350 francs at that time, in 1985.
    41:48.82-41:50.98 I had never heard of Scientology,
    41:50.99-41:53.65 because I was from a foreign country, Belgium,
    41:53.72-41:56.54 and the media didn't talk about Scientology as they do today.
    41:57.80-41:58.89 So I took this short course.
    41:58.93-42:03.87 350 francs, 2 weeks of work, spread out over several ...
    Paul Lefèvre
    42:03.99-42:04.98 Work on what?
    Alain Stoffen
    42:04.98-42:06.44 Well, it was a communication course.
    42:06.48-42:08.26 and consisted of very practical exercises
    42:08.82-42:10.74 that were quite interesting.
    42:11.40-42:14.97 And I came out with much greater assurance
    42:15.01-42:18.02 and with a large part of my stage fright gone.
    42:18.07-42:20.12 I wanted to perform on stage and I was doing that.
    42:20.16-42:21.12 This was very important.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    42:21.16-42:22.19 One thing that's striking in what you say,
    42:22.25-42:23.32 and I think it's important,
    42:23.36-42:26.02 is the impression that Scientology does not appeal only
    42:26.09-42:27.36 to people who are vulnerable.
    Alain Stoffen
    42:26.09-42:27.36 Alain Stoffen: Completely.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    42:27.40-42:30.34 It also attracts people who are seeking personal development.
    42:30.38-42:33.89 This is quite widespread nowadays, isn't it?
    42:33.93-42:38.09 Those who join Scientology aren't necessarily vulnerable people.
    Georges Fenech
    42:38.12-42:41.76 Fenech: No, any segment of society can be affected,
    42:42.24-42:45.64 beginning with celebrity artists, as Alain Stoffen just mentioned.
    42:46.07-42:48.17 Chick Corea, Tom Cruise,
    42:48.21-42:51.86 John Travolta, to name only the most famous ones.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    42:51.91-42:52.82 Bonnec: So how can ...
    Georges Fenech
    42:52.86-42:57.46 But there are also doctors, lawyers, ...
    42:57.51-42:58.97 It seems incredible.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    42:59.17-43:02.37 Apparently, the music school was a recruitment vehicle
    43:02.39-43:04.57 for Scientology -- the music school that hired you.
    43:04.78-43:07.87 How to detect such recruitment schemes?
    Georges Fenech
    43:07.95-43:09.31 Most of the time,
    43:09.84-43:14.12 the method that Scientology uses is the personality test.
    43:14.33-43:15.93 You're approached on the street
    43:16.82-43:19.23 by a friendly person who says,
    43:19.27-43:21.37 "This will only take a few minutes."
    43:21.84-43:24.06 "It's important for you to have information about yourself."
    43:24.10-43:26.65 "A personality test won't do you any harm."
    43:27.18-43:30.62 "It's painless. Come in. It's free."
    43:31.52-43:34.91 But later they say, "The results indicate real problems."
    43:34.95-43:36.08 "You have real problems."
    43:36.12-43:39.56 "Communication problems. You must take care of this."
    43:39.60-43:41.28 "Oh, how?"
    43:42.03-43:43.43 "We have the solution."
    43:43.99-43:45.21 "Come over and take a course."
    43:45.25-43:48.85 "It'll cost you 50 euros ..." to begin with.
    43:49.99-43:51.22 You go there, trusting them.
    43:51.26-43:52.80 There's no talk of religion.
    43:52.84-43:55.37 There's no mention of Ron Hubbard.
    43:55.41-43:57.14 They talk about things like --
    43:57.21-43:59.20 for Alain Stoffen it was music.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    43:57.21-43:59.20 Bonnec: They talk about you?
    Georges Fenech
    43:59.24-44:01.22 They talk about you and your personal development.
    44:01.26-44:04.58 "You have a real communication problem with other people."
    44:04.65-44:06.76 So you take a course.
    44:06.78-44:08.03 It doesn't work.
    44:08.09-44:09.27 It doesn't work, because the problem
    44:09.31-44:11.72 is much worse than first thought.
    44:12.26-44:15.29 So you have to buy a course package.
    44:15.80-44:17.24 And then they introduce the electrometer.
    44:17.28-44:19.14 "Look! With this, we will be able to detect ..."
    44:19.18-44:20.68 "This is a very scientific device!"
    44:20.72-44:22.21 And then you're caught up in the system.
    44:22.45-44:25.75 The bait is the personality test
    44:26.20-44:29.90 and afterward, you're exposed to many things that lie behind it.
    44:29.94-44:31.71 I found it interesting earlier
    44:31.75-44:33.93 when you [Paul Lefèvre] mentioned spirituality.
    44:34.17-44:37.71 If I may just this once turn the question back to you,
    44:38.36-44:39.77 Who, around this table,
    44:39.81-44:41.65 except perhaps for Alain Stoffen, maybe,
    44:42.07-44:46.51 can tell us what the beliefs of Scientology are?
    44:46.57-44:48.88 Aren't we --
    Paul Lefèvre
    44:48.92-44:50.50 In any case, it's not Ron Hubbard who could tell us,
    44:50.55-44:52.33 because I allowed myself to read,
    44:52.37-44:53.93 2 or 3 times, his first book and it's a ...
    Georges Fenech
    44:53.97-44:55.53 Fenech: But do you know what it is?
    Paul Lefèvre
    44:55.57-44:56.37 No.
    Georges Fenech
    44:56.41-44:57.58 Fenech: Ah!
    Paul Lefèvre
    44:56.41-44:57.58 Lefèvre: But he doesn't define it.
    Georges Fenech
    44:57.62-45:00.81 But he does. How is it that we talk a lot about Scientology,
    45:00.83-45:03.84 but no one is able to talk about its doctrine?
    45:03.88-45:06.13 You might tell me that doctrine should be no concern of mine,
    45:06.16-45:07.81 but, at least out of curiosity,
    45:07.84-45:10.65 what is the meaning of its programs, the electrometer,
    45:10.88-45:14.83 purification, 5 consecutive hours in a 60-degree-Celsius sauna?
    Paul Lefèvre
    45:14.89-45:17.46 Lefèvre: That's not doctrine.
    Georges Fenech
    45:14.89-45:17.46 Fenech: What does this lead to,
    45:17.53-45:19.44 since we're on the subject of spirituality?
    45:19.48-45:20.80 What did it lead to?
    45:20.84-45:22.93 To the truth revealed by Ron Hubbard.
    45:22.97-45:25.12 It's important to know that Ron Hubbard
    45:25.16-45:28.11 was a best-selling science fiction writer,
    45:29.05-45:31.39 and that he will reveal to you -- but not right away,
    45:31.43-45:33.88 because if it's revealed to you right away, you might die --
    45:34.40-45:38.01 You first have to pay around 200, 300, or 400 thousand
    45:38.04-45:39.98 euros or dollars, whatever it is,
    45:40.02-45:41.95 before receiving the revelation.
    45:41.95-45:44.31 This revelation, in a nutshell,
    45:44.35-45:49.89 is that, 75 million years ago, there was an intergalactic war
    45:49.93-45:52.84 and the great dictator Xenu ...
    Alain Stoffen
    45:49.93-45:52.84 Alain Stoffen: Exactly.
    Georges Fenech
    45:52.86-45:54.45 finally lost this war.
    45:54.49-45:56.02 He was frozen, along with thetans --
    45:56.38-45:59.65 about ... what? 16 thousand billion who were frozen
    46:00.09-46:02.19 and placed into the crater of a volcano.
    46:02.63-46:05.22 And Hubbard, thanks to his electrometer technique, etc.,
    46:05.28-46:06.90 will free your thetan.
    46:06.94-46:09.33 You are a thetan and you will free yourself from the thetan.
    46:09.85-46:11.38 Then you will know who you are
    46:11.74-46:13.14 and you will have the mental power --
    46:13.14-46:14.54 that's Dianetics --
    46:14.60-46:17.02 to act upon your body,
    46:17.74-46:19.53 and you become a superhuman.
    46:19.57-46:23.73 It's this quest for the original superhuman, essentially,
    46:23.77-46:27.56 from this intergalactic war that took place 75 million years ago.
    46:27.58-46:30.44 This is the spirituality and the doctrine.
    46:30.48-46:32.69 If this isn't science fiction ...
    Paul Lefèvre
    46:30.48-46:32.69 Lefèvre: Some believe this.
    Georges Fenech
    46:33.22-46:35.79 But it costs 300 thousand euros to learn this.
    Paul Lefèvre
    46:35.84-46:37.88 Lefèvre: Oh, yes.
    Georges Fenech
    46:35.84-46:37.88 Fenech: That's the problem.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    46:37.92-46:39.46 How long did you stay, Alain Stoffen?
    Alain Stoffen
    46:39.50-46:40.69 Stoffen: 15 years.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    46:39.50-46:40.69 Bonnec: 15 years.
    46:40.73-46:42.92 And what made you leave? I believe it was in 2001.
    46:43.55-46:45.25 What was the trigger?
    Alain Stoffen
    46:45.53-46:48.25 Oh, it was completely by chance.
    46:48.29-46:51.43 One day, because of an internal error,
    46:51.47-46:53.14 I gained access to the content of a file
    46:53.14-46:54.81 which should never have been accessible to me.
    46:54.85-46:57.16 It's called my "ethics file". So on ...
    Sidonie Bonnec
    46:57.19-46:58.77 Bonnec: It was your ethics file?
    Alain Stoffen
    46:58.81-47:00.07 Stoffen: Yes.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    46:58.81-47:00.07 Bonnec: All right.
    Alain Stoffen
    47:00.11-47:02.20 The organization has --
    47:02.23-47:05.26 this is known to members; members know this --
    47:05.43-47:10.66 that Scientology keeps files about them, in which --
    47:10.72-47:14.96 this is what I thought and it's what they tell us --
    47:16.12-47:20.62 they keep all the notes about our "spiritual progress".
    Sidonie Bonnec
    47:20.66-47:23.06 They invite you to make regular confessions, we could say.
    Alain Stoffen
    47:23.58-47:26.41 When you work by yourself, it's done in writing.
    47:26.45-47:29.09 When there is a session with an auditor,
    47:29.13-47:32.65 everything is put in writing and added to the file.
    47:32.67-47:39.61 So I thought it contained those reports and ...
    Sidonie Bonnec
    47:39.63-47:40.63 And what did you discover?
    Alain Stoffen
    47:40.75-47:43.79 Well, what I actually found was the whole extent
    47:43.85-47:45.45 of the manipulation that I went through.
    47:45.49-47:48.96 There was a time when I disputed sums of money
    47:49.00-47:52.60 they were demanding for services that had been harmful to me.
    47:52.64-47:55.68 I sent a letter
    47:55.88-47:59.84 to one of the highest justice authorities in Scientology,
    47:59.88-48:03.65 to express my disagreement and give my supporting arguments.
    48:03.69-48:06.11 I thought that, since Scientology ...
    48:06.15-48:09.50 What I thought was that they had a justice system --
    48:09.54-48:11.53 at least, that's what they were telling us --
    48:11.57-48:12.79 that was perfectly equitable,
    48:12.83-48:14.58 so I thought the response was going to be,
    48:14.62-48:16.47 "Okay, it's true that we made a mistake."
    48:17.90-48:20.38 "Excuse us. This debt is canceled."
    48:20.92-48:25.49 In fact, what happened is that a telex arrived, in which ...
    48:25.51-48:27.22 in response to my letter.
    48:27.28-48:32.08 I found this telex among tens, even hundreds of other documents.
    48:32.12-48:34.76 This was a telex ordering a sequestration.
    48:34.80-48:39.11 I was to be confined to a room, subjected to abject blackmail
    48:39.71-48:41.03 to squeeze money out of me.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    48:41.07-48:43.09 You filed a complaint. Did the Church ...
    48:43.13-48:45.18 How did the Church of Scientology react?
    Alain Stoffen
    48:45.98-48:47.19 Following my complaint?
    48:47.23-48:48.24 Oh!
    48:49.02-48:52.38 Well, you know, Scientology is very litigious
    48:52.42-48:55.01 and it can strike back quite hard,
    48:55.05-48:56.76 because it has enormous financial resources.
    48:56.78-48:59.36 And so it's true that I was the object of several complaints,
    48:59.40-49:01.52 of several procedures they initiated against me.
    49:02.29-49:05.28 Then ... Then, of course, there were intimidating phone calls
    49:05.32-49:08.96 and there are other maneuvers that are classic in that situation.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    49:09.00-49:09.59 Georges Fenech,
    49:09.64-49:12.19 do you recognize the methods of the Church of Scientology
    49:12.22-49:13.73 in what Alain Stoffen described?
    Georges Fenech
    49:13.77-49:15.35 I don't say “Church” of Scientology. The term "church" bothers me,
    Sidonie Bonnec
    49:15.39-49:18.07 Bonnec: Scientology "organization".
    Georges Fenech
    49:18.10-49:19.57 because this is where the confusion comes from.
    Paul Lefèvre
    49:19.58-49:20.59 Lefèvre: Certainly.
    Georges Fenech
    49:20.65-49:22.96 The law dates from 1901. It's an association.
    49:24.20-49:28.11 It's not a church in the sense of "congregation", if you will.
    49:28.15-49:31.24 Once again, they are free to believe in whatever they want.
    Paul Lefèvre
    49:31.29-49:32.68 Lefèvre: Even in Ron Hubbard.
    Georges Fenech
    49:32.72-49:36.27 I prefer to say “Scientology organization”.
    49:37.28-49:38.51 Now, the methods are well known.
    49:38.55-49:40.65 They aren't as old as the world,
    49:40.69-49:43.04 but as old as Ron Hubbard, who invented them.
    49:43.07-49:45.23 All you have to do is to look at his writings.
    49:46.41-49:51.78 Persons who are considered dangerous to the organization
    49:51.84-49:53.71 become the target of a special program,
    49:53.95-49:56.96 a program called “black propaganda” by Scientology.
    49:57.74-49:59.32 And they've become masters, in fact,
    49:59.36-50:03.37 at discrediting those they consider -- I'm using their term,
    50:03.41-50:04.88 because they have their particular way of speaking --
    50:04.91-50:05.89 “suppressives”.
    50:06.17-50:08.00 And there are classifications of persons
    50:08.04-50:12.06 according to the danger they represent for the organization.
    50:12.26-50:14.88 They have classifications and they use methods.
    50:15.71-50:16.41 That's it.
    50:16.45-50:19.78 So, we're facing an organization that is not ...
    50:19.98-50:20.98 They're not angels.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    50:21.15-50:23.30 It's been 8 years since you left ...
    50:24.09-50:25.94 this organization, Scientology,
    50:25.99-50:27.63 What still marks you today?
    50:27.69-50:29.31 What do you draw from this experience?
    Alain Stoffen
    50:31.06-50:31.78 What I would say
    50:32.54-50:33.91 is that it's really something
    50:33.94-50:35.30 from which a person doesn't recover completely.
    50:35.36-50:40.12 Because when ... the rebuilding process
    50:40.32-50:43.77 is intensely more difficult than the process of indoctrination.
    50:43.92-50:46.04 As I've said in the past,
    50:46.04-50:49.76 the doctrine aims to suppress critical thinking.
    50:50.32-50:52.51 When you leave, there is a feeling of shame,
    50:52.55-50:54.37 there is a feeling of guilt.
    50:55.45-50:57.91 For some, not me, but for many,
    50:57.94-50:58.99 there is a feeling of fear
    50:59.03-51:00.80 because this is an organization that inspires fear.
    51:02.12-51:03.23 So, in effect,
    51:03.27-51:05.98 people leave a kind of prison -- this was my case --
    51:06.58-51:08.89 and shut themselves inside a new prison.
    51:08.93-51:11.37 a prison shame, a prison of guilt,
    51:11.41-51:12.62 and, for some, a prison of fear.
    51:13.12-51:16.24 So when a person is out and has lost all critical thinking,
    51:16.27-51:18.04 what the person must, in fact, do to rebuild
    51:18.08-51:19.81 is to take responsibility for what happened.
    51:19.85-51:21.23 To take responsibility, you have to understand.
    51:21.27-51:22.70 To understand, you have to analyze.
    51:22.74-51:26.45 And when your only points of reference are from Scientology,
    51:26.49-51:29.23 it's almost mission impossible to rebuild yourself.
    51:29.27-51:30.39 And it's true that it's work
    51:30.43-51:31.74 and it was ...
    51:31.99-51:36.18 Well, for me, this process lasted several years.
    51:36.23-51:38.10 Today, I'm truly moving forward with my life,
    51:38.34-51:42.22 but this was something that leaves scars.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    51:42.35-51:44.21 And in order to understand, you've written this book,
    51:44.23-51:45.97 “Journey to the Heart of Scientology”,
    51:46.00-51:47.70 which has just been published by Éditions Privé.
    51:47.77-51:49.07 Alain Stoffen, thank you. Stoffen: Thank you.
    Alain Stoffen
    51:47.77-51:49.07 Stoffen: Thank you.
    Sidonie Bonnec
    51:49.10-51:50.34 Georges Fenech, thank you very much.
  5. Ann O'Nymous Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    Well done, Thanks.
  6. N. Ron Rubber Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    «Le Pouvoir Caché» est une série québécoise. ;-)
  7. Olrik Member

  8. peterstorm Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    Travail superbe encore une fois.
  9. jensting Member

  10. Ann O'Nymous Member

  11. AnonyMary Member

    Re: "Le mystère des dossiers disparus"

    That you all for compiling and posting this.

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