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Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

Discussion in 'Scientology Property Tax' started by RolandRB, Jun 17, 2010.

  1. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

  2. AnonyVix Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Clearly there has been a big misunderstanding, a very big misunderstanding...

    Do the scilons realise that any statement they make is immediately spread globally, examined in minutia and cross referenced in all relevant countries? That contradictions are spotted within hours if not minutes of such statements being made.

    As a UK citizen, I demand back taxes, when do I want them? NOW! Who do I want them from? All COSRECI related entities...

    I'd say "we" but I can't be sure anyone else would support me in this demand. I know one thing, I will be straight on to my MP, we have a bloody deficit to pay and we're all going to have to make big sacrifices.... <rage>

    TheyWorkForYou.com: Are your MPs and Peers working for you in the UK's Parliament? Hansard++
  3. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    We don't know that COSRECI owes any back taxes in the UK. It is set up to always make only a tiny profit and in some years make a loss. The way the Church is run in the UK is that the churches owe for licencing, the training of their executives and the Sea Org missions that are sent in. With the Ideal Orgs they will owe the offshore Scientology companies that own them the rent. So in total they do not make a profit. The huge amount of money that flows in is used to pay their debts. Therefore not liable to corporation tax. If it were VAT they owed then this would not come out of their pockets - it would be charged to their customers and COSRECI would hand it over to HMR&C. In any case, VAT would only be charged on their tapes and CDs as books are exempt and the courses are exempt as they are "educational". The only thing they could be got for is their business rates rebate and this would not be a back tax. The best that could happen (from the critics point of view) is that they lose their business rates rebate for their larger premises that have this rebate applied.

    Where they might owe tax is in their fraudulent accounting practices where money comes in and is not declared on their accounts anywhere. This should be taxed at a penal rate. But I can't see the Inland revenue doing a damned thing about it even if somebody could prove it. The Inland Revenue are there to put the frighteners on the little man so he pays up his thousand pound or so out of fear. It is not there to take money off international fraudsters that owe them hundreds of millions of pounds.
  4. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Far be it from me to throw water on any cynical fire. :) However, a point actually in keeping with your perspective, yet leading to a different conclusion: if the little guy sees a big guy getting away with not paying a tax owed, the little guy may feel a bit less loyally compliant. Enough of that, and the big guy just might have to take one for the team. Thus, spreading awareness of the cult getting an undeserved free ride may have the needed effect of motivating the authorities to action, if only to stave off the appearance of favoritism.

    Dox is the key, and we seem to has them....
  5. Sponge Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    On the face of their UNAUDITED financial statements from Companies House then yes, it is not uneasonable to assume that little or no back taxes would be due, on the face of those numbers, perhaps. I don't have the reference to hand, but a non-profit can hold a trading surplus without being taxed on it providing you can show that it is earmarked for furthering the non-profit activities and not for private inurement. You don't literally have to be seen to break even or make a loss to avoid being taxed. What the precise thresholds in terms of % or turnover, timescales and consistency are I'm not sure. We could probably find that out somewhere.

    However, since their accounts are not audited and then they get found out admitting to making incorrect statements about their claimed status regarding tax liability (with added pressure from authorities in the juristiction where the offshore association is based)...then....?
  6. AnonyVix Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I too am something of a cynic on these matters and agree we don't know if scientology owes back taxes but I sincerely believe they do, with that in mind here is a letter I sent my MP via:

    TheyWorkForYou.com: Are your MPs and Peers working for you in the UK's Parliament? Hansard++

    They Work for You asks you for your postcode and tells you who your MP is, then if you wish it will format a letter for you and send it when you have completed writing what you wish to write. Piss easy to use and it is free and you don't have to register.

    Obviously you have to namefag & addressfag yourself but one would hope MPs will not be inclined to share your comments with Co$. I don't believe in being scared of writing to your MP, the more do it the more our voice will be heard, it's called lobbying.

    UK ANONS: You're welcome to use my wording to your MP but try some originality too, oh and you might want to check the grammar too for the odd mistake. :-D
  7. Bird Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

  8. xenubarb Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    How strange it it sometimes, that I can sit in San Diego and watch video of a girls' choir in Australia, singing a song we used to belt out around campfires.

    This communication marvel is what's gonna bring down the Masters of Communication. Cuz they're doin it rong!
  9. BigBeard Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Interesting bit from Scientology 'offended' by tax evasion accusation | Adelaide Now

    Wonder who the other 8 countries are, and whether they've been advised about what's going on??
  10. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Why does COSRECI file unaudited financial statements with Companies House instead of audited accounts. Its income is in excess of £10M per year and its property is worth about £20M (although it claims huge liabilities against their assets). Does this not mean they are supposed to file audited accounts?

    COSRECI zip can be downloaded at the following URL which contains unaudited financial statements for a number of years.

    Download COSRECI.zip for free on uploading.com
  11. Sponge Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    It fucking beats me. I've trawled through shitloads of shit and other than the small companies exemption (which it fails the thresholds by a long chalk) and exemptions for regulated financial companies and insurance market businesses (which they are not), I can't seem to find any obvious reason why they should be allowed to file unaudited statements.

    What audit-exempt companies and limited liability partnerships must send to Companies House | Business Link
  12. greebly Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    It's because auditing is a thorough process as Andersons and Enron will tell you.

    Or some of the following

    It has less then 250 "employees" and it's turnover does not exceed 22.6mill or it's assets are less than 11.4mill. - 2 conditions here must be met.

    Or

    It is an "Overseas Company" and does not need to file "audited" accounts in that country.

    You should give Mr Hodkin a ring as I am sure he is fully aware by now.

    Wether "not for profit" entities are exempt or "Overseas charities" or private companies where the articles of association or shareholders have not requeted it.

    Or The entity is in good financial health.
  13. greebly Member

  14. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I reported it to Companies House yesterday.
  15. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I got an auto "do not reply to this message" response from them.
  16. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?


    Dear Mr Rashleigh-Berry

    Thank you for your email enquiry.

    The company concerned was registered as a place of business of an overseas company and was required to deliver accounts under sect 700 of the Companies Act 1985.

    Essentially the company must deliver a balance sheet, profit and loss account (with comparative figures from previous period), and notes. There is no requirement for an auditor's report or a director's report to be filed.

    If the company is not required to disclose audited accounts under parent law, this will not significantly change under the Overseas Companies Regulations 2009.
  17. Anonymous Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    So because the Oz entity is 'charitible' (hurr hurr) there is no need.

    Silver, rather than gold this time mebe, but /r/ fwd original email to Xenu and Today Tonight.
  18. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    This doesn't "feel right" to me. Is the assumption being made that the UK operations are just a subsidiary and that they file full accounts in Australia or at least according to the laws there?
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Well, they fully stated in their return IIRC that they are a subsidiary of an Australian charity. Where's the 'assumption'? I just see fraud.
  20. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    This does not feel right so I wrote the following back to Companies House. We'll see if it gets anywhere.

    Dear Sir,

    I thank you very much for your prompt reply. I have a further question directly related to your reply to help clarify this issue.

    Is the assumption being made that the parent company in South Australia submits accounts there in accordance with parent law and that the UK is purely a subsidiary? if so then does it have any bearing on this issue that the company in Australia has not submitted any accounts there for more than thirty years and has no business dealings in Australia whatsoever? That all its business is conducted in the UK and nowhere else?

    I look forward to your helpful clarification on this.

    Yours sincerely,
    Roland Rashleigh-Berry
  21. Random guy Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Pardon my tinfoil, but there's something here that does not smell kosher. How come the authorities all seem to have swallowed the cults story hook and sink without any question? Du they usually do that? I would think that, with the amount of money going through the cult, the revenue service should have made at least a wee background check.
  22. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    There's no need. It's a South Australian Charity ya know.
  23. Sponge Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Thanks Roland for getting it from the horses mouth. Looking forward to the response to your 2nd request. I'm not sure they can comment in any sort of detail without having the evidence, but a hypothetical answer would be a starting point.
  24. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    It might provide a useful tool for the Australian end.
  25. BigBeard Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Huh? I thought it was an SA "non-profit", but not listed as a "charity".

    Did I miss something during the PBT hearings in Oz??

    BigBeard
  26. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    It says they are a South Australian Charity not only on all the unaudited financial statements they lodge with Companies House but also on their application form for mandatory rates relief that you can see below.

    http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/10257/response/26340/attach/3/Application.pdf

    Are you accusing them of committing fraud or something?

    Shame on you. This is a religion, dammit!
  27. BigBeard Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Fraud? Never!

    Let's just say there appears to be a disconnect between reality in SA and perceptions in the UK.

    BigBeard
  28. DeathHamster Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    After not filing any returns for 30 years, I'm really surprised that COSRECI is still a valid South Australian incorporation. I'm sure that there is a long delay period (and numerous notifications* sent) before a government would declare a non-profit company null, void and dissolved, but thirty years wtf?! (Is there a yearly fee required as well?)

    * Sent to a bogus address, ha!
  29. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I can not find it on the Australian web site so I would conclude that the company does not exist in Australia.

    ABNLookup - Welcome to ABN Lookup
  30. DeathHamster Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Then they can't be an overseas company operating in the UK, can they?
  31. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Exactly, but Companies House seem to be happy to carry on with the situation even though COSRECI does not exist anywhere except in the UK.
  32. Random guy Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    That they do not appear in the database does not mean they do not exist, it is a strong indication they don't exist, but you can't prove a negative. Before we can cry foul, we'll need some official papers from some Australian authority on their actual nature (existence/non-existence/inactivity, charity/non-charity). Could some of you glorious Aussifaggs help here?
  33. BigBeard Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Actually, it does.

    It's not in the ABN, but it is listed with ASIC as a non-profit, not as a charity.

    See: ASIC Free Company Name Search

    BigBeard
  34. Anonymous Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    No, Roland. First, COSRECI is not a company. It's an incorporated association and, therefore, a corporation, but not a company.

    Second, it would have to have an ABN if it earned more than $150,000 in Australia OR if it wished to be endorsed as a registered charity to be exempt from income tax.

    COSRECI DOES exist - as evidenced by the Extract from the South Australian register of associations which has been leaked in this thread.
  35. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    This thread is smelling like win.
  36. Sponge Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Tick Tock

    Remeber that after the Today Tonight expose of the COSRECI anomalies, the authorities over there were supposedly informed about all this already.

    Of course we must remember that in the grand scheme of things the cult of scientology would be pretty low priority in terms of international fraud. Then again, things that get a disproportionately high exposure in the media do sometimes tend to get moved up the queue. I just wished there was more in the UK media.
  37. AnonyVix Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I believe what is happening is that COSRECI is paying corporation tax but including notes to the effect that it believes it shouldn't have to so in future it can claim back the tax; I believe there has been an example of exactly this but can't recall exactly when except that it was with the cult.

    Also thanks to some "parent" law it avoids auditing of the accounts, which may prove convenient.

    Am I right?
  38. RolandRB Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    I think you are right.

    Yes, under section 700 of the Companies Act 1985 it only needs to file brief accounts in the UK as it is considered to be a subsidiary of an Oversea Company. This was told me by Companies House. So I wrote back and asked them if it mattered that the parent company in Australia had not filed accounts there for more than thirty years. No reponse yet.
  39. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Maybe another person could inquire about the same thing, to show that it's not just you taking an interest. Perhaps a personal visit by multiple Chanologists armed with vidcams might even be in order, to record the response and post it for everyone to see.
  40. Anonymous Member

    Re: Is COSRECI a charity in the UK?

    Bits from HMRC website for background:

    Of course, the cults UNAUDITED returns show essentially no profit, because the US sucks any excess back via a number of artificial charges, fees, inspections etc. None of which would fly if the accounts were properly audited.

    So while it's true that they manage to avoid corporation tax by claiming to be an offshore charity, it's not exactly straightforward.

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