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French trial: the media

Discussion in 'Media' started by Olrik, May 25, 2009.

  1. Skeptic1337 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Gah every time I read about their 911 propaganda with the blue sweat it makes me fucking rage.

    Such lies! The little cult propaganda fucker was hated for being a clueless fucking moron.
  2. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Looks like someone boarded the failboat this morning.
  3. auchraw Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Catching up with a great pile of posts, my guess would be that this was rehearsed, to arouse pity and sympathy for a poor woman whose ''religious beliefs" of many years were being relentlessly exposed as a pile of garbage. It might also serve to deflect an awkward question or deflect an attack.

    <<Seated one beside the other, the seven [sic] accused from time to time raise their eyes upward, burst out laughing, or express indignation.>>

    I am sure the judges have seen all this done much better before.
  4. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Bet they didn't laugh when they got told the euro wasn't used until 2002. :)
  5. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Just to get this straight -- their doc was an utter fabrication, then, right?
  6. Skeptic1337 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    No they were just showing the judge how scientology is at cause over time and space.....IN THEIR MINDS.
  7. indeedindeed Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Don't see how it could be otherwise. According to wiki the final exchange rates of euro to european currencies were set on 31 december 1998. Before that the euro wasn't used as an official currency anywhere and I think the "exchange rate" with Francs was still subject to change.
  8. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    cesarjoker.jpg
  9. auchraw Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Must be since it purports to relate to cash, actual notes and coins which didn't come into circulation until 2002. The earlier 2-3 years involved only paper transactions in which Euro calculations were duplicated in the national currency (French francs).

    This is lovely. I have seldom been so well entertained.
  10. TinyDancer Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    • David Root co-wrote the Introduction to “Clear Body, Clear Mind”, the Hubbard text about the Purification Rundown;
    • David Root is on the Narconon International Science Advisory Board (Narconon International is a Scientology organisation which uses the Purification Rundown in the context of drug “detoxification”);
    • David Root used to practise under the business name "Healthmed Detox": David E Root, MD - Preventive Medicine, Sacramento, CA - which is presumably the "occupational medical facility in Sacramento, California" referred to in the Steering Committee bio of the Utah Meth Cops Program, which states that he "supervised the detoxification of more than 3,500 individuals suffering from the effects of occupational or environmental exposure to toxic chemicals and drugs". The bio doesn't disclose that Dr Root's facility utilizes (or utilized - unsure if it still operates) the L. Ron Hubbard Purification process.

    http://web.archive.org/web/20070808084634/bwellclinic.com/biographies.html


    http://www.clearbodyclearmind.com/endorse.shtml
  11. iaxiloll Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    They are Scientologists. The can do what ever they please dammit. They are clearing the planet.
  12. kitfisto Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Any chance of having the OP updated rather than having to go through walls upon walls of text and bullshit to get the gist of what has been developing ?
  13. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    +1
  14. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    [IMG]
  15. TinyDancer Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    If someone writes up a tl;dr, I'll add it to the OP.
  16. auchraw Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    If these alleged doctors are scientologists, their opinions are a lot of hogwash.

    The French are very very protective of their professional cadres. No way can you buy a doctorate in France.
  17. mnql1 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    AFP: A l'Eglise de Scientologie, "on ne fait pas un centime de profit personnel"

    Source text also available in the French thread on the same subject.

    Quick translation:

    In the Church of Scientology, "No one receives a cent of personal profit"

    Paris (AFP) - The representative of the Celebrity Center, a showcase for the Church of Scientology in France, assured the Paris Correctional Tribunal on Wednesday that the members of the association, which is on trial for organized fraud, never got rich personally.

    "No one receives a cent of personal profit," insisted Eric Roux, adding: "We are not saying we are not happy when a member makes a large contribution, but these funds benefit none of us financially: Scientology can help humanity to progress and all funds are devoted to this."

    Yes, Scientology does require "contributions" from its members, he conceded, but it is not the only religion to do so: the same is true for the Hindu religion and the Anglican Church, which also list "fees" for the religious services they offer their followers.

    "I imagine you've been well trained ...", presiding judge Sophie-Hélène Château commented a few minutes earlier, at the beginning of the hearing, referring to several instances of testimony indicating that, "in Scientology, we were trained to lie in court."

    "What you heard is absolutely false," retorted Mr. Roux, "the truth is a very important component in Scientology."

    For three hours, the presiding judge attempted to peer through the Scientology nebula in matters of accounting and organization by the many questions she aimed at the representative of the Spiritual Association of the Church of Scientology - Celebrity Center (ASES-CC).

    Asked about the personality test, considered as a promotional tool by the complainants, Mr. Roux insisted that "99% of people do not come to Scientology through this test, but directly."

    "What about hard sell techniques?": "There were never any directives to that effect," he said.

    Regarding refund requests from dissatisfied members, they are, he said, "reimbursed 100%" and the allegations of the accusers are nothing but "lies".

    The prosecution is expected to sum up on Monday, before the defense delivers its closing arguments on Tuesday and Wednesday.
  18. auchraw Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    "I imagine you've been well trained ...", presiding judge Sophie-Hélène Château commented a few minutes earlier, at the beginning of the hearing, referring to several instances of testimony indicating that, "in Scientology, we were trained to lie in court."

    "What you heard is absolutely false," retorted Mr. Roux, "the truth is a very important component in Scientology."

    LOL
  19. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    TR-L and "may be...lied to" FTL, fraudsters.
  20. Sponge Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Hmm....

  21. Consensus Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    "the truth is a very important component in Scientology" is a DRAMATICALLY different statement than, say, 'In Scientology, Honesty is ALWAYS encouraged' or 'In Scientology, lying is seen as out-ethics, sinful you might say'

    I believe the first statement is true. The truth a very important component. It's important to tell 'acceptable truths.' It's important to prevent people realizing certain truths. It's important to control what people think is true. The truth is a VERY important component.
  22. Ann O'Nymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Funnily, this is one of the threads with the less BS. Are you on baby food ?
  23. peterstorm Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    This is the crucial part of the trial. The prosecution hadn't been able to convince that Co$ profited from the donations. This is why the case was dismissed the first time around.

    Will they be able to demonstrate de money scheme without a doubt? Co$ uses the same old tactics and arguments. It's for the judges to see through all that BS.

    Something tells me police looked into bank accounts in places like Switzerland but nothing seems to have transpired so far.
  24. mnql1 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Les scientologues se disent désintéressés - Faits divers - 10/06/2009 - leParisien.fr

    Source text also available in the French thread on the same subject.

    Quick translation:

    Scientologists claim no self-interest

    Anne-Cécile Juillet | June 10, 2009, 22:36 | Updated : 22:39 (Paris time)

    If the stakes are so high for the Church of Scientology in France at the organized fraud trial which began on May 25 in Paris, it's because a conviction as a legal entity could entail its dissolution.

    On Wednesday, the court heard the testimony of Eric Roux and Aurore Nadler. The former is a representative of the Celebrity Center, one of Scientology's two Parisian sites.

    The latter represents SARL SEL, the bookstore which is located within the Scientology premises and markets the works of its founder, L. Ron Hubbard. The actual manager since 1997 refused to be present at the trial. She lives in Denmark, where the headquarters of Scientology in Europe are located. Since taking that post, she has visited the Paris bookstore only "five or six times".

    At the Correctional Tribunal, Eric Roux, tall, lean, and speaking in a calm voice, spent three hours testifying. This "Minister of the Church of Scientology", accustomed to preaching, appeared completely at ease in front of the audience, to the point of sometimes wanting to set the pace. Before letting him speak, the presiding judge, Sophie-Hélène Château, made the cryptic comment: "I imagine you've been well trained," a veiled reference to several witnesses who explained that, "In Scientology, we were trained to lie in court."

    "We are not a department store!"

    Eric Roux replied simply, "This is totally false" and dismissed out of hand all the testimony against his organization. His message was summed up in a refrain which he repeated over and over on the witness stand: at the Church of Scientology, "no one puts a penny in his pocket." Yes, Scientology requires that members pay "contributions", but what church does not? Yes, we are delighted when we receive large donations, like any church that wants to "help humanity to progress." No, it does not seek new followers according to their income. No, there is no re-invoicing outward to the mother house.

    When the tribunal pointed out that the testimony of Scientologists and even the writings of Ron Hubbard state that target numbers must be met, he retorted that these are religious ... and that the financial aspect is inevitably connected with religion. "We are not a department store," argues Eric Roux, denying any form of telephone chasing of followers who participate little, as one plaintiff lamented, or any form of "hard sell".

    The tribunal heard the explanation on that subject from Aurore Nadler: "In reality, hard sell means taking care of a person, this is how Scientology defines it" said the de facto manager of the bookstore. "Really?" said the presiding judge with a look of surprise. "Yes, this means that we take as much time as necessary to understand a person's needs." And then sell "religious services".
  25. DeathHamster Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Does the Chewbacca Defense translate well?
  26. Re: French trial: the media

    This bit caught my eye

    Did he just deny that CoS send money uplines?
  27. Anonynamefag Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    If he did, then he just committed perjury. Again.
  28. DeathHamster Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Maybe he'll deny that Author Services Inc (CST) is the mother house?
  29. LilDebbie Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    ...and that paying $2000 for a set of idiotic sci-fi books is a perfectly legitimate price range. look at how much college textbooks cost!
  30. Anon_1HG Member

  31. basil Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Erm.

    http://www.xenu-directory.net/documents/corporate/fsm.html

    Sounds like making a personal profit to me... a "church" based on commission... whodathunkit?
  32. anonymous1312 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Hm, the organisation calling itself the church of scientology's art of acceptable truths:

    Could it be that the word financial is being taken literally to be money directly in pocket perhaps? Rather than say, affording them some more indirect benefit.

    (That said I know that translation can loose some meaning where one language has more expressions for variations on a concept than another.)

    I also know that often times the money really does flow up hill and very little is left so low down so it may be a simple statement of fact. They fleece people out of money as instructed by the organisation to benefit the organisation, ultimately the leader, but they don't gain from it; indeed many cases suggest they may suffer from it.

    Wonder if they will ask where the money goes? Buys books. What books? Dianetics and other Hubbard books. And who gets the money from that? The publishers, who pay license fees to RTC and all manner of other soak costs and voilà the money it is gone! Oh right that's okay then, as long as the money is gone...

    Erm no, the argument shouldn't be about who benefits from the money it should be about whether the person who "contributed" the money was conned!

    Got to love that bit at the end though.

  33. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    That's like a rapist saying that he takes care not to ruin the surprise of the sex his women are going to get.
  34. Skeptic1337 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Your joke was almost funny.

    Your sentence structure needs work.

    Unless you were drunk.

    If so, carry on!
  35. mnql1 Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    Procès de la Scientologie : «J'ai subi un préjudice moral» - Faits divers - 11/06/2009 - leParisien.fr

    Source text also available in the French thread on the same subject.

    Quick translation:

    Scientology trial: "I suffered psychological damages"
    Aude-Claire Malton, former follower and victim

    Marine Scherer | June 11, 2009, 18:50 | Last updated: 18:51 (Paris time)

    For two weeks now, in the 12th Chamber of the Paris Correctional Tribunal, seven members of the Church of Scientology (ASES-CC) of Paris have been on trial for organized fraud and illegal practice of pharmacy. They are alleged to have duped two young women over ten years ago in order to extort money from them. Late Wednesday evening, after more than six hours in session, the presiding judge confronted the civil parties with the defendants.

    Aude-Claire Malton, one of the plaintiffs, approached the witness stand to be heard. Looking nervous, she said she was pressured by Jean-François Valli, one of the defendants, who is alleged to have talked her into buying additional courses. For her, this approach qualifies as harassment.

    "I haven't given you 140,000 euros"

    The questioning turned to the evening of July 14, 1998. According to Aude-Claire Malton, Jean-François Valli insisted on accompanying her home in order to have her sign checks. "He seemed impatient to receive the money." His refutation: "She had been shopping and had a lot to carry. It was her idea. I was helping." He said he was shocked by the accusations. "I don't understand. It's very hard. Here I am, in court, and my life is at stake." He added: "When Madame Malton had something to say, she would come out and say it! We've always had very good relations." To conclude, he made a forward motion and said: "It was just like you and me, Madame la présidente!"

    Sophie-Hélène Château smiled: "No sir, I haven't given you 140,000 euros yet!"

    The defense repeatedly emphasized that, in her first statements, in 1998, she spoke of "the sense of well-being she had in the church."

    In response, her lawyer, Olivier Morice, said these were "words taken out of context" and recalled other statements made by his client: "I said many times that I could not pay." In the final round between the victim and the accused, Alexis Gublin, one of the lawyers for Scientology asked Aude-Claire Malton: "You received a refund from Scientology, do you have any other damages?." She replied: "I took nine years to recover from this ... I suffered psychological damages, I expect compensation."
  36. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    lol

    thx mnql
  37. JohnnyRUClear Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    [IMG]
  38. genoramix Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    gotta loooove this
  39. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    i see what you did thart
  40. Anonymous Member

    Re: French trial: the media

    excellent scifag pwnage! lurv this judge

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