Egypt goes berserk

Discussion in 'Freedom of Expression' started by Anonymous, Jan 25, 2011.

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  1. Anonymous Member

    This has been repeated a lot, but I've yet to see any convincing evidence for it. Seems to be the US making up another boogeyman.
  2. Anonymous Member

    The muslim brotherhood assassinated Mubarak's predecessor in an openly brash attack during a military parade. Don't underestimate a group of fanatics organized into a strict hierarchical military power structure who are willing to die for and kill for their leaders. Democracy is fragile and depends on honest people taking power who will not be murdered by power-hungry extremists who use religion as a tool to gain legitimacy.
  3. Anonymous Member

    Democracy also depends on an honest military and police willing to defend the interests of the people over the selfish interests of the generals.
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Anonymous Member

    Didn't really answer my question about convincing evidence that they were waiting in the wings, or that they are planing to take over this movement. If anything all the footage I have seem, and all the interviews with the protesters, indicates that the MB has fuck all say in what is occurring. I don't see Islamic flags or hear Islamic slogans - only Egyptian flags and Egyptian chants.

    So why the fuck are people persisting in spreading this shit about a group that has little influence, if any, in this movement?
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Anonymous Member

    A top MB spokesman on Al Jazeera:

    “We cannot reduce the popular movement into one political party. That would be a humiliation to Egypt.”

    “The Muslim Brotherhood do not intend to present a candidate for government.”
  6. Anonymous Member

    Anyone know what is going on at the protest at the Egyptian Embassy in Manchester? Twitter makes it sound like the police are getting ugly?
  7. Shinythings Member

    Because people are afraid
  8. CarltonBANKS Member

    wikileaksBiden says Assange is a "terrorist" and Mubarak is "no dictator"--and should not step down. Biden is a dangerous fool.
    5:12 AM Jan 28th via webRetweeted by toptweets and 100+ others

    scavendish Fascinating: Cairo residents removing passwords from wifi routers so protesters have easy access to communication

    about 17 hours ago via TweetDeckRetweeted by toptweets and 100+ others

    Wylieknowords In Cairo, Egypt people in the streets holding hands to protect museums. In America Teabagger Republicans defunding the arts and sciences

    about 19 hours ago via web from Richmond, VARetweeted by toptweets and 100+ others

    b6n How is everyone enjoying their little preview of why the US Congress wants an off switch for the Internet?

    2:01 AM Jan 28th via EchofonRetweeted by toptweets and 100+ others
  9. anonsoldier Member

    Yes, because no one has ever in the history of time said one thing and then done something completely different.

    Also, if I were a strategist for an Islamic fundamentalist group, I wouldn't present my group at this point in time. Right now it's just the initial reaction against the government, the opening salvo of the fight that will require solidarity and unity amongst the protestors. The Northern Alliance within Afghanistan was comprised of separate groups that, prior to fighting the Taliban, were busy fighting each other at every opportunity. Throw in a religious fundie group now as a way to spearhead the movement and you give the Egyptian government a clear and defined threat that they'll hit with overwhelming force that should make the current reaction look like a stroll in the park.

    No. The correct route is to wait until the united, faceless, nameless mass protest removes the government from power and throws the country into anarchy. Then you take the Hezbollah/Taliban approach and begin offering services to the community, services you can provide because you are well funded and well organized. Every other group out there will not have the organization, manpower, or funding to quickly organize and shift gears towards civil reconstruction and implementing life support systems. Once you have the people reliant upon you, you start to seize power through force and eliminate your competition. In short order you have a religious state in Egypt, a subdued populace, and the spark of freedom rubbed into the dirt.

    It is imperative that the protests have an endgame in mind. We have the advantage that there is no need for an endgame when removing the Co$, as once they are gone then that is that. Removing the government will require a follow on plan and resources. The best we can do is not worry about what may come, but push to the end state of this phase. When the fighting begins to end, then we must keep our eyes peeled for a subversion of the revolution.
    • Like Like x 6
  10. CarltonBANKS Member

  11. Sickx Member

    Use of censorship in an attempt to control citizens who wish to explore the extent of corruption in their government? You deserve to be more than protested against, Mr. Mubarak.
  12. subgenius Member

    (Please indulge me):
    There's Something Wrong In Paradise
    (August Darnell aka Kid CreoIe)

    On the land beyond the beach
    Where the smell of flowers fills the air
    There's a man beyond your reach
    There's no trouble that can touch him there
    He's the ruler of the isle, citizens will suffer for his style
    They go hungry everyday, seems to me a case of foul play

    There's something wrong in Paradise
    Now someone's got to pay the price
    I'm sorry sir I can't deny, there's something wrong in Paradise

    Eating octopus and fruit in a garden that's beyond compare
    He don't ever have to move, servants cater to his every care
    He's so full of bile and rum, he's oblivious to native drums
    Beat so angrily they moan, not so distant from his safety zone

    There's something wrong in Paradise
    Now someone's got to pay the price
    I'm sorry sir but I'm not blind, there's something wrong in Paradise

    On the land beyond the beach
    There a smell of bloodshed in the air
    And the man beyond your reach
    He's asleep and doesn't seem to care
    There's a banging at his door, it's the wretched army of the poor
    Now they pillage and they rape acting so much like the man they hate

    There's something wrong in Paradise
    Now someone's got to pay the price
    I'm sorry sir I won't be kind, there's something wrong in Paradise
    So very wrong in paradise...
  13. Rockyj Member

    Observing this too, could we possibly have a leaderless society where the hive mind makes all decisions?
    • Like Like x 1
  14. Anonymous Member

    US leaked cable on new VP Omar Suleiman: "His loyalty to Mubarak seems rock-solid"
  15. Rockyj Member

    CNN reports that isn't true.
    Also rumors (not verified) that members of the Mubarak's family have been seen @ airports and in other countries.
  16. The class structure in Egypt changed. Well connected "businessmen"who entered the economy after government entities were de-regulated now control the economy. Decisions about food are made based on profit for the controlling group. They have markets overseas for Egypt's crops, so overseas they go.
    These riots are about food and an economy with no interest in the welfare of the people of Egypt. The businessmen just learned why that won't work.
    • Like Like x 1
  17. subgenius Member

    Ignore me:

    System of Madness
    (August Darnell )

    This is the real deal baby
    Coming at you from the deep recesses of my mind
    Philosophical food for thought, mama
    Feed the brain, smell the coffee
    Wake the fuck up, be bold
    Silence is deadly, but wisdom is gold

    I believe in the system of madness
    I believe in the power of freaks
    I believe in dismissal of taxes
    I believe in the slaying of beasts
    I believe in the bitches and bastards
    I believe in the taste of the feast
    I believe in the healing of sadness
    I believe in disturbing the peace

    (If the peace is not peace for all, but a peace for some I'd rather be a rebel than a devil,
    but you, you just sit there commiserating, wake up, get up,
    do something about it, do something about it)

    I believe in the system of madness
    I believe in the power of truth
    I believe in dismissal of classes
    I believe in the hour of youth
    I believe in the brave and the reckless
    I believe in the freedom of speech
    I believe in the power of excess
    I believe in the teachers who teach

    (And not just recite back the figures, baby
    we need to know the real deal
    so we can act upon it, not sit on it,
    you ain't got a clue)

    I believe in the system of madness
    I believe in the power of truth
    I believe in dismissal of classes
    I believe in the hour of youth
    I believe in the brave and the reckless
    I believe in the freedom of speech
    I believe in the power of excess
    I believe in the teachers who teach
    Satisfaction guaranteed baby
  18. subgenius Member

    With Muslim Brotherhood Set to Join Egypt Protests, Religion’s Role May Grow

    ALEXANDRIA, Egypt — Demonstrators in Egypt have protested against rising prices and stagnant incomes, for greater freedom and against police brutality. But religion, so often a powerful mobilizing force here, has so far played little role.
    That may be about to change.
    With organizers calling for demonstrations after Friday prayer, the political movement will literally be taken to the doorsteps of the nation’s mosques. And as the Egyptian government and security services brace for the expected wave of mass demonstrations, Islamic groups seem poised to emerge as wildcards in the growing political movement.
    Reporters in Egypt said on Friday that, after rumors swept Cairo late Thursday that the authorities planned to throttle the protesters' communications among themselves, access to the Internet, text messaging services and Twitter was not possible on Friday morning in Cairo, Alexandria and possibly other cities.
    Heightening the tension, the Muslim Brotherhood, the largest organized opposition group in the country, announced Thursday that it would take part in the protest. The support of the Brotherhood could well change the calculus on the streets, tipping the numbers in favor of the protesters and away from the police, lending new strength to the demonstrations and further imperiling President Hosni Mubarak’s reign of nearly three decades.
    “Tomorrow is going to be the day of the intifada,” said a spokesman for the Muslim Brotherhood here in Egypt’s second largest city, who declined to give his name because he said he would be arrested if he did. The spokesman said that the group was encouraging members of its youth organization — roughly those 15 to 30 years old — to take part in protests.
  19. xenubarb Member

    Have you heard of the great investment opportunities to be had by investing in gold coins?
  20. Anonymous Member

    I kind of think that this cigar is just a cigar. With a 25% unemployment rate, there are a lot of young adults who see only poor options for their future. They may be "angry idiots on your tv screen," which I find interesting.

    One, that you're calling them idiots.
    Two, that you're sitting on your fat ass passing judgment as you watch the idiot box, as you admit you have no idea what's going on.

    You might have a future at Fox News.
    • Like Like x 4
  21. Rockyj Member

    Another report:,7340,L-4020765,00.html
  22. anonsoldier Member

    tl;dr = Fundies will come later, strategically it's too soon for them to profit. Wait until the revolution hits the next step.
  23. Shinythings Member

    What the fuck is waiting Mubarak to resign?
  24. Rockyj Member
  25. Anonymous Member

    That was yesterday. Looks like the NYT was wrong.
  26. Anonymous Member

    Democratic elections seems a specific and achievable goal, and seems to be the desire of every protesters interviewed so far. Methinks you are trying to justify a fear that has no supporting evidence, and in fact seems to be the antithesis of what all the protesters are saying.
    Of course not, since no governing authority can function for the people without transparency. Anonymous doesn’t exactly do the transparency part.
    It is amazing how often that tends to happen when simply printing the US party line.
    • Like Like x 4
  27. Rockyj Member

  28. from the NY Times:
    The role of the Muslim Brotherhood, an Islamist opposition group, remained unclear. The group had initially declined to take part in the protests, which started Tuesday, saying the holiday — Police Day — was a time for Egyptians to come together. But as the protests grew, the group was scrambling to get its own people out on the streets.

    edit via al-jazeera: members of the MB have been arrested and detained as they are found by miltary forces

    been watchin Al-Jazeera, ny times, and cnn as well heres what ive seen
    1. the protests in uk an france number in the hundreds and about a thousand respectively though it hasnt gotten violent
    2. the army is starting to side with the demonstrators, i.e. protecting them from state security forces
    3. the move of mubarak to appoint a VP has greatly weakened his position and regime. the VP is a former head of spy intelligence, and the MP he's appointed is the commander of the air force
    4. cell service has returned, still no internet
    5. water has been cut off by a group of "thugs" in one of the larger districts
    6. the citizens have created neighborhood patrols to protect themselves and have even assumed duties such as traffic and relief control. the citizens have created sec groups to protect themselves
    7. the military arent fighting or firing on looters or "thugs" ( though they have urged civilians to protect their valuables)
    8. an estimate 100 people have been killed ( many bodies indicate death by live fire or rounds)
    9. the state security forces are brutal and committing crimes such as looting. forces are also forgoing rubber rounds in some instances and going straight to live fire
    im gonna update as more stuff comes
  29. Rockyj Member

    Very powerful vid!
    • Like Like x 3
  30. anonsoldier Member

    Come on, every religious extremist group is right now thinking on how to capitalize this for their best interests. It's a question of when, not if. I bet you every intelligence agency in the world has been doing the same thing and advising their leaders accordingly. Hopefully, for the US, that advice is "sit this one out and don't get hands on involved". Denouncements of violence, calls for support of freedom and stuff, that's all well and good, but direct involvement right now is going to be political suicide.

    The Muslim Brotherhood saying they will get involved does run counter to what I said earlier, that religious groups are going to sit it out a bit longer, but I think that their involvement will be less in an active role of trying to steer the revolution and more in a passive role of simply supporting it and letting the people drive it.

    I'm still fuzzy on a lot of the details, as I've literally just spent a week cut off from all communications to the outside world. I didn't even know about this until yesterday afternoon. My analysis remains that involvement of religious extremists is a when, not if. I don't think that it should change anything. The regime being removed is clearly the desire of the people and I'm down with that. Will it be as big as the hype has been, that remains yet to be seen. I merely related my assessment based off how this has usually gone in the past in Palestine, Lebanon, Iraq, Afghanistan, and anywhere else where religious extremists have seized political power to an extent.
  31. Anonymous Member

    Translation: We still have fuck all evidence against the MB when it comes to this movement, but we will still keep plugging this line anyway.
    That’s your problem right there. Had you been following developments you might have realised the difference between what you are trying to spew and what is actually occurring on the ground in Egypt. Until you have evidence regarding the MB, or any religious group for that matter, you should probably STFU.
    • Like Like x 2
  32. Sickx Member

    It truly brings to light the seriousness of the situation.
    That was incredible.
  33. Al-jazeera crew was mugged while reporting
  34. subgenius Member

    Guy says "We will not be silenced. Whether you are a Christian, whether you are a Muslim, or whether you are an atheist. You will get back your goddam rights...." Chilling.
    Another "Today I will die...."
    We do not have balls of steel. These people do.
    Something in my eyes.
  35. One reason for the riots:

    WikiLeaks Egypt Cable | Released: 1-28-2011Anonymous Operation: "To Egypt with <3"
    Classified By: Ambassador Margaret Scobey


    "The GOE has not yet made a serious
    effort to transform the police from an instrument of regime
    power into a public service institution."
    "The police use brutal methods mostly against
    common criminals to extract confessions, but also against
    demonstrators, certain political prisoners and unfortunate

  36. Leon Wilhelm Member

    What the f....
  37. Rockyj Member

    Very heartfelt & moving...tears
  38. Chrome596 Member

    Whoa Rockyj that is a powerful interview i am just in awe and to be honest moved almost to tears by that man's sentiments.
  39. Anonymous Member

    We just haven't been pushed as far as they have been. Also we actually have freedom, even if we act like idiots when we do or do not take advantage of the freedoms we take for granted.
    • Like Like x 1
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