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Editorial: Independent Scientology Orgs fucked up by not addressing Stop Scientology Disconnection

Discussion in 'Independent Scientology' started by CommunicatorIC, Apr 26, 2016.

  1. Editorial: The First Independent Church of Scientology, Milestone Two and the Religious Liberty League fucked up by failing to address the Stop Scientology Disconnection billboard project.

    Usually, I just cross-post news. Right now I'd like to make an observation. My observation is prompted by Dave Soroka's response to the Stop Scientology Disconnection billboard project.

    https://www.gofundme.com/reconnectingfamily

    * * * * * BEGIN EXCERPT * * * * *

    Dave Soroka 1 month ago

    This is a great idea, but I think you'd get even more support if you directed the assault more at the Church than at Scientology itself. There's a lot of Independent Scientologists out here, myself included, who will take this billboard as an attack on Scientology, rather than on the suppressive use by the Church of a cancelled policy. I wonder if you might consider re-wording it to read "To my loved one in the Church of Scientology..."? Please consider this.

    * * * * * END EXCERPT * * * * *

    DaveSorokaRespondsToStopScientologyDisconnectionCampaign.PNG

    As you may have guessed, my opinion is that the First Independent Church of Scientology (FICS), Milestone Two (MS2) and the Religious Liberty League (RLL) fucked up by failing to address the Stop Scientology Disconnection billboard project.

    That, even leaving aside considerations of mere Wog morality, and considering only public relations, the failure of FICS, MS2 and RLL to address the Stop Scientology Disconnection billboard project was and is moronically, imbecilically, and pathetically stupid.

    This was the perfect opportunity for Independent Scientology FICS, MS2 and RLL to publicly and repeatedly say, "We are different. We, unlike the corrupt corporate Church of Scientology, do not practice disconnection, in fact oppose disconnection, and wish to reunite all disconnected families."

    If the the members and supporters of Independent Scientology FICS, MS2 and RLL had a single brain cell between them, they would have supported the Stop Scientology Disconnection billboard project, while making it clear (and perhaps even garnering some agreement if not consensus) that the "Scientology" referred to on the billboard referred only to the corrupt corporate Church of Scientology, and not to their practice of Independent Scientology.

    Instead, their silence was deafening.

    Their failure, of course, was and is also a moral one -- albeit a moral failing common in the practice of Scientology: the placing of their particular Third (Group) Dynamic over all other considerations, all other concerns -- Scientology Third Dynamic Uber Alles. This is seen in Dave Soroka's pathetic whining that Independent Scientologists, himself included, would take the billboard as an attack on Scientology.

    In closing I'll add that to date, and much to my initial surprise, neither Independent Scientology FICS, MS2 nor RLL have even addressed the coming book by Ron Miscavige, the father of corporate Church of Scientology leader David Miscavige, or the 2020 and other media coverage thereof. This despite the fact that Independent Scientology FICS, MS2 and RLL place all of the blame for all of the failings of Scientology solely on David Miscavige. Again, we see the, to put it most kindly, stupid and morally repugnant inability to express anything negative about any form, organization or conception of Scientology. Again, we see the Independent Scientology police of the Scientology Third Dynamic Uber Alles.

    One might pity Independent Scientology FICS, MS2 and RLL in this regard if their silence in the face of evil was not so revolting.
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  2. fishypants Moderator


    Not
    • Like Like x 3
  3. fishypants Moderator


    Also not.
    • Like Like x 1
  4. RightOn Member

    They have no desire to wake up or can't wake up
    Either way, it's sad.
    Hopefully some day Scientology will be viewed by ALL as the joke it is and created by a con man fraud who died hiding from the law.
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  5. thesneakster Member

    For those who didn't see it previously, Mike Rinder posted a public announcement from Dave Saroka on his blog some time back. Per that, Mr. Saroka has been an Independent Scientologist since August 2013.

    That having been said, I fail to comprehend just exactly why Mr. Saroka thinks anybody in the general public would identify Scientology in that billboard as anything other than David "Darth Midget" Miscavige's Church of Scientology, given the great pains taken to create a total identification of the former term with the latter group. What exactly Mr. Saroka thinks either Indie group could possibly have done about that billboard, had they been inclined infringe on the advertiser's right of free speech, is also complete mystery to me.

    Michael A. Hobson
    Independent Scientologist
    email: warrior_mike2001@yahoo.com
    Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mhobson2011
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  6. fishypants Moderator


    Quick question Sneakster: what *is* independent scientology's view on disconnection?
    • Like Like x 2
  7. thesneakster Member

    There is no monolithic "independent scientology" with a single common view/opinion about everything, any more than there is a monolithic Anonymous view on everything. There are multiple factions amongst the Independent Scientologists and I don't speak for any of them, just as no one person speaks for Anonymous.

    Speaking solely for myself, it is my observation that Indies pretty much agree that "Disconnection" as practiced in David "Darth Midget" Miscavige's Church of Reverse Processing is entirely evil.

    In Co$, "Disconnection" is enforced by the organization under threat of Suppressive Person declaration, Expulsion from the Co$ along with cancellation of any auditor certification should one refuse. Disconnection is the ultimate club used to beat down any disagreement or failure to comply with Dear Leader's dictates. The threat of loss of one's family, friends and the destruction of one's business (through loss of clients) as a result of Disconnnection used as a tool of political control is easily the single most heinous cult practice of Radical Corporate Scientology.

    The origin of the above procedure is Scientology Policy Directive 28 issued on 13 Aug 1982 by the "Watchdog Committee" (entirely anonymous at that time). The true authorship cannot be proven at this time, but it was most likely David "Darth Midget" Miscavige in his capacity of Mission All Clear I/C who ordered it.

    A copy of SPD 28 is webbed on Gerry Armstrong's site at the following URL: [ http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/cult/sp/spd-28-1982-08-13-txt.html ].

    Now, to answer your question as best I can, a bit of a digression is first required:

    Standard Scientology(no TM) case supervision (per Hubbard's materials) for a person discovered to have become a Potential Trouble Source (they have become ill, are having accidents and/or doing stupid things) demands that the PTS person first get that condition handled so they are no longer PTS as they will not make any stable case gain from routine auditing otherwise. The audited procedure of Search & Discovery would be used to locate the source of suppression and whether it is in Present Time (Type 1) or someone or something that is acting as a "restimulator" for suppression in the PC's past (Type 2). In either case, it is the the preclear who identifies and names the source of suppression - not the auditor, C/S or some organization executive.

    In the case of a Type 2 situation, the PTS condition should just blow upon the preclear spotting the source of past suppression and differentiating them from the apparent suppressive in the present when the S&D is run correctly. In the case of the Type 1 situation, the PC is going has the following choices: (a) handle the source of present time suppression so they are no longer being suppressed, (b) disconnect from the source of suppression (at least until they complete their training or processing) or (c) discontinue their training or processing.

    In the case of suppression from a family member, it has been proven over time that option (b) only makes the situation worse for the PC *AND* for field auditor, group or organization, so the PC is limited to option (a) or (c).

    So far as I am aware, amongst Independent Scientologists (no TM) practicing Standard Scientology, the only penalty for refusing to handle a PTS condition is that the client will be refused further services until they handle the PTS condition. Nobody gets forcibly cut off from their family or friends, has their business ruined or gets subjected to a PR campaign to vilify them to other Indie Scientologists for the purpose of Dead Agenting them to other Indies.

    Independents do not practice anything even remotely like the calculated viciousness that is "Disconnection" in the Co$.

    Michael A. Hobson
    Independent Scientologist
    email: warrior_mike2001@yahoo.com
    Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mhobson2011
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  8. fishypants Moderator

    Yup, fair enough - understood. Probably a good thing in itself.

    It's good that people recognise that.


    Undoubtedly that's a good thing.


    I guess I don't quite understand why that is - wouldn't it be more helpful (if the 'services' are beneficial) to keep on with the 'services' so as to help the 'pre-clear' 'handle' the 'PTS condition'?




    It looks like we're going to have to disagree on the origins of disconnection, I thought it was Hubbard's letter of 18 October 1967 as shown below:

    original-conditions-formulae1.jpg

    (the bit I'm looking at is "DOUBT: Not to be communicated or argued with").

    Anyway, regardless of whether it was originated by Hubbard or Miscavige, it's good that Indie Scientologists aren't doing it.

    I agree with CommunicatorIC that indie scientology is missing a trick (in PR terms, and in making-up-for-past-mistakes moral terms) by passing up the opportunity to support the billboard campaign against disconnection.

    Anyway, thanks for the detailed response, it was interesting. Follow-up question (if you're willing):

    * why does becoming ill or having accidents make a person a "potential trouble source"? Isn't that just bad luck that could happen to anyone?


    ----

    Extra bit added later: We're both talking about a person as a 'pre-clear' above. I think I know what you mean - someone who's receiving Scientology 'auditing' / 'training' / 'services' - but does that presuppose that there is such a thing as a state of 'Clear'?

    Are you 'Clear' or do you know anyone who is, and if so what does it mean to be 'Clear'?
  9. Random guy Member

    Not to use this chance to distance themselves from disconnection is a failure only if one assume they actually think the policy (and the rationale behind it) is bad. If they think that disconnection per see isn't necessarily an evil, keeping mum is the absolutely smartest thing they could do.
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  10. anon8109 Member

    Aha!

    I always suspected that Miscavige was a deeply embedded Anonymous agent, decades before anyone ever even knew that Anonymous existed!

    He has been carefully and surreptitiously destroying the Scientology corporation from within all this time while living the lavish life of an emirate sheik.
    Sure there have been casualties along the way, and good people have suffered, but he has pretty much succeeded at achieving a 90% reduction in the number of homo novii since he usurped Hubbard's throne.
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  11. Actually, cancelled or not, the Disconnection policy is a perfectly good policy, used properly, which would be almost never. In my life I've had to disconnect from violent and threatening people who wouldn't stop attacking or be handled in any other way, maybe twice, and those situations were just in my personal life, nothing to do with being a Scientologist. They were situations which could have otherwise ended with serious injury or loss of life. My point was just that the way the Church uses Disconnection - constantly and for little to no reason - is suppressive. Not whinin', just sayin'...
  12. Disambiguation Global Moderator

    You could use restraining orders instead of the Disconnection policy. The restraining orders are more effective. Unplugging your phone when threatening people call works well too. All without a religious connection.
    One doesn't need a Disconnection Policy to navigate life successfully, ya know what I mean?
  13. RightOn Member


    I hope you are able to get your head out of Hubbard's ass some day.
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  14. Independent Scientology 'Orgs' fucked up by trying to sell more of this insane LRH processing to anyone for any reason. Wake Up, You got duped by a fraud, you're out now, move on. It does not work, Hubbard's entire biography (all of it) and laughable alleged research has been exposed as a big scam.

    Google: L. Ron Hubbard: Scam
    Google: l. Ron Hubbard: Abuse of Children in Scientology by policy

    Why would you want to follow this abusive monster after he's been thoroughly exposed as a Fraud who brought misery to his deluded followers. like all of you Independents. Stop the abuse of LRH phony 'Tech' for your own self-serving benefit.
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  15. tl;dr
    The issue with "Independent Scientology" isn't the "Independent" part.
  16. DeathHamster Member

    Why can't people decide on their own if they should limit their connections or not?
    Why does the organization need a policy to order members to disconnect, with blackmail if they don't?

    "For their own good" is bullshit. The answer always turns out to be "for the good of Scientology".
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  17. Of course not, I agree completely. The issue with all of Scientology is L. Ron Hubbard's mind-numbing processing and the total control it has had over every indoctrinated member. Control is the key element of any cult.

    Independent Scientology will pick and choose which LRH policy to enforce on their new members depending on who the particular practitioner of this brand of LRH 'Woo' is.

    There are zero clears, Independents are selling and promoting Hubbard horseshit that doesn't work, never has to very vulnerable subjects. This is fraud. Ex-Scientologists need real help and time to decompress, not more auditing from a kinder, more gentle scam. Independent fraud with no oversight from deluded former cult members is absurd.

    Independent Scientology poses a very significant danger to any current Scientologist or recent ex-Scientologist who turns to them for their help at a steep cost both mentally and financially, The last thing an ex cult member who has finally escaped needs is more of the same controlling processing from former cult members who have 'discovered' their own brand of Woo.
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  18. Your attempt to blame L. Ron Hubbard's Disconnection Policy on the Watchdog Committee that you believe was most likely written up as an order from David Miscavige (Scientology Policy Directive 28 issued on August 13, 1982) is completely absurd.

    David Miscavige is a very abusive product of Hubbard's policies and tech. He's been strictly on the enforcement side of Hubbard's very own Scientology Disconnection policy that was in effect before DM was even born.

    I feel bad for you and the way you twist yourself into a pretzel to defend the brutally abusive monster L. Ron Hubbard and his totally debunked 'Tech'. I understand very well how many people with good intentions originally got sucked into Hubbard's controlling scam of Scientology like you did.

    The decades of feel good low level electric current auditing and mind numbing processing that indoctrinated you and many others still have a serious grip on you. Wake Up once and for all, Hobson. Stop promoting this controlling 'Tech' on recent exes. Leave them alone to heal at their own pace and get some real help for yourself.

    You should certainly know by now that the Scientology's brutal, controlling Disconnection Policy was put in place decades ago by Hubbard himself and has had many, many victims since the 60's. For PR purposes he issued his 'Reform Policy' in 1968 that was never really put into place as we all know, you know like the 'reform' of fair game that never happened.

    Clearly Disconnection was not started by the Watchdog Committee as you claim. It was started by the abusive monster, your hero, L. Ron Hubbard many, many before the Watchdog Committee even existed. There were already thousands of victims of Hubbard's Brutal disconnection Policy by 1982.

    WAKE UP HOBSON!
    Please stop promoting and defending Hubbard's dangerous scam. All Scientologists and their families have suffered enough including the Independents who cling to the LRH mindfuck like you do.
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  19. DeathHamster Member


    Are there any copies of that policy letter other than from the singular one handed to the commission in New Zealand as a "we don't do that any more" shore story?

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dumbleton–Powles_Report

    It appears in a book or two, but those are just copies of the the New Zealand one.
  20. No offense, but shouting "wake up!" at someone who already considers themself awake feels a bit TR0'ish to me, and the sort of thing that would 'introvert' someone further: to retreat into their comfortable shell. The outside world is scary, and stumbling through without the support of an old "friend" (e.g Ron) must be terrifying.

    But yeah. I draw the line between encouraging Indy-exes to find their own way out, and discouraging them from passing that abuse on to others. its frustrating watching someone abuse themself, but abusing fellow victims needs to stop.
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  21. I believe that policy letter by Hubbard was strictly in response to the New Zealand crisis that Scientology was facing at the time.

    Hubbard's disconnection policy was in force for many years before and after that letter right up to this very day. There are still quite a few Scientologists who haven't spoken with parents/ children and other family members or others who spoke out in some way against Scientology.

    By the time the Watchdog Committee's letter came out in 1982 there had been many disconnections going back to the 1960's under the LRH Disconnection Policy.
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  22. Y so reactive, Ron???
  23. I agree with you on the majority of ex-Scientologists and current Scientologists being victims who have suffered under Hubbard's brutally abusive, controlling policies. I differentiate with active Independent Scientologists who still promote the sale and continuation of the mindfuck in their own Independent versions like Hobson has for a long time. (Sorry about the Caps on Hobson's Wake-Up call, it may be too late, but there's always hope.)

    Hobson's been out of his shell for a long time, sadly he's totally absorbed in expanding Hubbard's 'tech' despite overwhelming evidence to its failure. Unless he believes he's the one and only Hubbard 'Clear' with perfect vision, total memory recall and freedom from the vast majority of human illnesses as promised.

    Are you a Hubbard 'Clear' Hobson? Can you name anyone who has achieved this wondrous state of being 'Clear' after undergoing extensive LRH processing? Anyone? 1 Name?

    Many Independents are trying to make money offering dangerous auditing sessions and more on their own, I find this to be criminal, it's outright fraud. They've been out long enough to have done some 'Independent' research of Hubbard's lies on their own. It's detestable that they try to profit at the expense of vulnerable exes. I protest Scientology in any and all forms, I hope Hobson does wake up someday but anybody promoting more of Hubbard's lies needs to be called out on it.

    The very last thing that any ex-Scientologist needs is more Scientology from Hobson or any other Indy.
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