Doinitrite locations - FOI's

Discussion in 'Scientology Property Tax' started by Bluebell, Oct 18, 2010.

  1. Bluebell Member

    Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Edinburgh -


    Manchester Org -

    Trafford - Proposed Ideal Org - Sci rates relief: Trafford

    The area identified is an industrial site of which none of the occupiers are entitled to any reliefs.


    Brighton -


    Plymouth - Org - Sci rates relief: Plymouth

    There has been no application for any mandatory or discretionary relief from non-domestic rates.

    Plymouth Ideal Org - Sci rates relief: Plymouth

    No application has been received for any mandatory or discretionary relief.


    East Grinstead - Sci rates relief, St Hill Manor

    "There has not been any application for rate relief in the last ten years."

    NOTE: This seems VERY strange


    Birmingham Ideal Org -

  2. Bluebell Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    How come Sci's haven't bothered for rates relief in EG, yet are bothered for rates relief London, Birmingham and Sunderland?
  3. RolandRB Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    As I explained on more than one occasion it is because of the history of the place. Hubbard buys St. Hill Manor in 1959 and needs room for people doing courses. He uses the outhouses for this. He rebuilds them using permanent foundations without planning permission. He needs even more room so he decides to build a mock tudor castle in the grounds without planning permission. He had a chapel built without planning permission and asked for it to be a registered place of religious worship and it was refused. The local authority is hardly likely to give him mandatory rates relief on a castle he should not have built and this in an area of outstanding beauty.
  4. Sponge Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Not an explanation.

    If you build something without planning permission and after a certain time has elapsed without anyone lodging any complaint then, providing it meets building codes of course, you might expect to get retroactive permission(?). I'm no expert but if they hadn't got planning permission for the castle before they built it then the reason it is still there is perhaps because it was retroactively granted, otherwise it would be flattened by now. I don't know. You do the research and prove it with dox.
    We know that the cult did get retroactive change of use planning permission from Sunderland council on one or both of two properties in the same building on Fawcett St. purely as a result of lack of complaints or action by the council over a period of time (which might have pissed some people off had they known). Yet they didn't hold a grudge and as a result stop them from getting rates relief did they?

    The point is that the building or it's owner's histrionics has nothing to do with any other due process, especially if there is no official dispute over it now. Speculation about possible feuds and grudges between the council and the cult and it affecting business rates decisions is not helpful. Please give me another more sensible reason why you think the cult didn't apply for rates relief for its UK HQ in the last 10 years? Could it be that simply their bluff was called on an application more than 10 years ago but is no longer on record and that the cult is not likely to ever litigate because it knows it will lose when thorough investigation would reveal that COSRECI isn't a fucking charity anywhere (and a legal precedent would be set for the whole of the UK)? Who knows.
  5. RolandRB Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Anybody can Wiki it or Google it. The St. Hill castle thing went to appeal and the clams won.

    C.H. Rolph 'Believe What You Like' - Chapter 6
    Public inquiry made history // Scientology development appeal heard | East Grinstead Observer | 25 July 1968
  6. Sponge Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    and you are saying it is because of that local history that scientology hasn't applied for the rates relief, but that's not an answer. It's an opinion, just like my previous post above was and not something you could give to one of the other councils as a solid basis for rejecting scientology's applications in those areas (aside from the case law of the Segerdal case).

    You'd need to be a fly on the wall inside scientology to know what scientology's exact reasons are for not applying. Our opinions agree in that the local council is probably the wisest of them all in this respect precisely because of that long history and are more likely to fight any application for business rates but it doesn't explain definitively why the cult hasn't even applied when it could stand to save a fortune every year on business rates for those vast premises and in view of its success in CoL, Westminster, Birmingham and Sunderland.
  7. Anonymous Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Q. What is the rateable value of the SH property?
  8. Sponge Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    I don't think we've ever been able to determine that to our complete satisfaction. It is a composite property with part buiness/part residential.

    On the valuation website for business rates there is no entry. Unless I'm doing something wrong, it is just not there.

    On the valuaton for council tax it is listed as composite. In the current council tax listing for St.Hill the Band column says "deleted" and I don't know what that means other than perhaps because it is a composite business/residential property then it doesn't have a Band and maybe it is worked out as a special case after inspection (and which you won't be able to find out about due to FOI exemptions on the tax affairs of individuals or organisations).

    However a quick google did reveal an article (which might even be a quote taken from another article) which says that the rates bill for St.Hill is nearly £100,000 per annum but there is no source other than the same valuation website which returned nothing for me on rateable values for that address.
    That article: Cranmer: Labour

    I don't know whether that claimed figure was supposed to be just the annual business rates aspect and that there's a residential portion to add or whether that it is the total composite business/residential figure per annum.
  9. Anonymous Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    You'd have to ask Peter Hodkin. ;)

    My suspicion is that they think they can't bullshit Mid Sussex District Council the way they've tried to bullshit other local authorities - on the 'public benefit' aspect - because Scientology is far too well-know in East Grinstead for that to wash.

    But hey, who knows why the crazy cultists do what they do? Perhaps Xenu said so.

    - WT
  10. Sponge Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Oh to be a fly on the wall in his solicitors office. Not that you'd able to hear him over the constant noise of the shredding machine ;).
  11. Anonymous Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    Hmm. After working with the UK civil service I realised that I could get away with not paying capital gains tax providing my situation was sufficiently complex and I flew beneath the radar (the too-hard tray is nearly bottomless). (yeah, so sue me, this was years ago)

    Now it would be very difficult in theory for SH to 'fly beneath the radar', but the nature of a bureaucracy is that unless a higher-up asks a direct question on an underling, an awful lot can get missed, 'cos underling really doesn't give a toss. If I were to put on the tinfoil, I might wonder if they'd paid any rates at all...

    I smell an FOI req for the total SH business rates paid over the past decade coming on...
  12. Bluebell Member

    Re: Doinitrite locations - FOI's

    When did Scientology come to the UK?
  13. Anonymous Member

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