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Chinese web censorship - what can we do?

Discussion in 'Think Tank' started by Anonymous, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. Anonymous Member

    One of the largest censors on the web is the Chinese government.

    Chinese citizens are prevented from freely browsing the web - certain sites and search terms are blocked.

    What can we do to assist them (citizens) in getting around this?

    Some schemes are in place - can we help provide them / promote them / improve them / educate people in their use?

    A local perspective on this issue would be particularly useful.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_censorship_in_the_People's_Republic_of_China

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2012/dec/14/china-tightens-great-firewall-internet-control
  2. Anonymous Member

    Get better leaders. They got the communists into power now maybe it's time for the people to get someone else in.

    There is over a billion Chinese citizens, they don't need our help, they just need to get together.
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  3. Anonymous Member

    Well, yes.

    Free access to information could be part of the "getting it together" process, in the long term.
  4. Anonymous Member

    Well maybe a billion Chinese could get together and decide what they want without our interference.
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  5. Anonymous Member

    Making options available for those who want to bypass China's censors is not interference. It's giving people more freedom and power to decide for themselves whether to use the tools or not to access the forbidden sites.
    • Like Like x 2
  6. Anonymous Member

    It's pretty simple: Those of us outside China might be in a position to help those of us inside China.

    If you want to blame the victims of a repressive regime for the existence of that repressive regime, then I guess you won't be taking part. OK - that's fine with me.
  7. Bump.

    Web censorship anywhere is an affront.

    One world, one internet.

    • Like Like x 1
  8. raboon Member

    I think the best plan would be to quit teaching computer skills in school and then wait 25 years for the Chinese to take over the world.
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Anonymous Member

    I don't live in China, so *shrug* not my problem.

    The Chinese managed to build a sublime (though imperfect, as all are) human culture which imparted many, many inventions and discoveries to the rest of the world.

    Wanna bet they will figure a way around this one, too?

    Just because the infant West calls China "a developing country", "third world" or worse, the facts remain.

    They don't really need the West and its influence. Frankly, I think they don't give half a tinker's damn.
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  10. Anonymous Member

    Let them get their porn another way.
  11. Anonymous Member

    That's your opinion.
  12. Anonymous Member

    Was that your best shot?
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  13. fishypants Moderator

    • Like Like x 2
  14. Anonymous Member

  15. Anonymous Member

    fifync
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Anonymous Member

    Well if the people's of china are pissed off about it they will seek to change it. The internetz isn't the only way information and knowledge spreads.
  17. Mine and the UN's. Free access to information is a universal human right.



    http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/index.shtml
    • Like Like x 1
  18. Anonymous Member

    Again. That is their opinion. You cannot force your beliefs on others. If they want that freedom then it's up to them to seek it.
  19. Anonymous Member

    Why this sudden retreat into parochialism?

    We've never said that events in America weren't our business because we're European, or events in Europe weren't our business because we're American, or events in Egypt weren't our business because we're not Egyptian, or that events in Scientology weren't our business because we're not Scientologists.

    The Universal Declaration of Human Rights is more than an opinion.

    So, if you don't want to be interested in anything outside of your own country, or your own home-town, or your own street, then don't get involved.
    • Like Like x 1
  20. Anonymous Member

  21. Anonymous Member

    If the chinese people want a free internetz and they are seeking help then by all means, but to state that our laws and our beliefs must be enforced worldwide is a dangerous attitude. Egypt etc was a different situation, the people were against their govs and then it was ok to lend a hand. Scientology? What has this to do with the subject of another country?

    The stance that the people of china MUST have freedom of internetz is ok if you are the one enforcing on others. What if everyonee decided that their ideals should be enforced worldwide? Slippery slope.
  22. Anonymous Member

    The internetz isn't the great cure all you think it is, look at how it has encouraged conspiracy theorists etc.

    You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink old chap.
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  23. Anonymous Member

    Parochialism.

    You seem to be saying that things that happen to other people - outside of our own nationality, our group - are none of our concern. That we should only be concerned with things that affect our own selves.

    The equivalent situation with Scientology would be for us to shrug and say that it's for the victims to leave the cult themselves. That to try to help would be "enforcing on others".

    Nobody's proposing enforcing anything. If people don't want to read about democracy or anti-communist Chinese politics, for example, no-one's going to make them.
  24. failboat Member

    I think I can settle this:

    http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Who_signed_the_Universal_Declaration_of_Human_Rights

    The problem, though, is that China was experiencing the Communist Revolution at this time, and the New Order may have declared null-and-void the agreements of the Old.

    China is still a member of the UN; since that time, the UDHR has been ratified by many more countries, not fewer, including the 8 members that abstained, some of which no longer exist.

    If it were true that China had somehow nullified their agreement to the UDHR with the Communist takeover, then China would be the only exception that I know of that rejected the UDHR after having been among the historic first signatories.

    Rather, I think China is still a signatory, and that AFL is right to call them out on their failure to uphold this agreement.
    • Like Like x 2
  25. Anonymous Member

  26. Anonymous Member

    What I was saying, if you read my post, was help when asked.

    And yes, you are trying to enforce something, you call it a free Internet. Others may not see your views, take your head out of your ass and try to think that your opinion and rights may not be wanted elswhere.
    • Dislike Dislike x 1
  27. Anonymous Member

    I believe that all people have certain human rights.

    Obviously you don't believe in that concept - but you're in the minority.

    A cultural relativism which says that people of other nationalities have no human rights - or have lesser human rights - than Americans or Europeans, purely by virtue of their nationality or their race, seems repugnant to me.
    • Like Like x 1
  28. The Chinese internet citizens are really starting to make their voice heard.
    Regardless of take downs like this
    http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-china-21597752
    Last year there where large protests against corruption and pollution.
    Still journalists and bloggers still need to be careful.
    When a journalist is taken for questioning they call it getting taken for a cup of tea.
    When they are detained they say they are going on holiday.
  29. Anonymous Member


    http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk/sto/news/world_news/Asia/article1193304.ece

    http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/57c27222-e5a9-11de-b5d7-00144feab49a.html#axzz2MIv6nLrU
  30. Anonymous Member

    It all depends on your view of the internetz because that is what we are discussing, I believe everyone has a few basic human rights, free access of everything on the nets is not one of those in my opinion.
    • Like Like x 1
  31. Anonymous Member

    Actually I agree, I don't see free access to everything on the net as a basic human right either.

    For example, if a country wants to censor its internet connection for porn, then I can understand that.

    The net censorship in China, though, is political censorship: material is being censored because it's critical of the current government, of people in positions of power, or of Communism in general.

    For example, any web page that mentions specific opposition politicians, or certain writers critical of communism or its leaders, are inaccessible from China. Anything that mentions the Tiananmen Square massacre is censored.

    People do have a basic human right, I think, to discuss or find about about ideas, politics and history freely. And without being dragged away by the secret police afterwards.

    And, we're not just talking about censorship of the net - other forms of media are also blocked. For example, China is now jamming the BBC World Service's Chinese news transmissions (radio). And of course print media is controlled by the state.

    So I'm not saying so much that Chinese citizens have a right to access all of the net necessarily, as that they have a right to the free exchange of information - free speech and free access to other people's speech - in some form. Which right now they don't have.
    • Like Like x 1
  32. The Wrong Guy Member

    Tiananmen Square Anniversary: Social Media Censored, Journalists Hassled in China

    The Chinese government went into media control overdrive during the 24th anniversary of the bloody suppression of pro-democracy activists in 1989.

    By Clarence Tsui and Scott Roxborough

    HONG KONG – The Chinese state security apparatus went into overdrive in its surveillance of both broadcast journalists and social media users today, as the country marked the 24th anniversary of the bloody clampdown on the pro-democracy movement in Beijing in 1989.

    For the second day in a row, public security officials went out of the way to interfere with Hong Kong reporters stationed in the Chinese capital, as a group of radio and television journalists were detained for an hour near Tiananmen Square just as the daily flag-raising ceremony took place nearby.

    A report aired on Television Broadcast Limited (TVB), the biggest terrestrial station in Hong Kong, said uniformed policemen stopped their press car as they arrived to report on the daily flag-raising ceremony at the square. An officer called on his colleague to “catch that journalist,” before searching through their car and demanding that all reporters present -- including journalists from Radio and Television Hong Kong (RTHK) and those working for another television station -- to show their identity cards.

    The TVB report also said an officer asked reporters to delete photographs in their cameras because the pictures “violated the privacy and rights” of the officers whose pictures were taken. While the reporters were eventually allowed to leave, the incident was seen as the latest incident in the authorities’ ongoing attempt to intimidate Hong Kong journalists working in Beijing during what has become the most politically sensitive day in the calendar.

    On Monday, uniformed officers visited the same TVB reporter in her office and “invited” her to a meeting at the neighborhood government office near her Beijing residence, during which she was “reminded” of the need for journalists to file an application before conducting any interviews or simply shooting any footage on the streets.

    Continued at www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/tiananmen-square-anniversary-social-media-562510
    • Like Like x 1
  33. Anonymous Member

    Censorship is expensive. Censorship costs money, man hours, and the inconvenience it imposes has economic consequences as well. From my experience as a troll, i have seen Chinese accounts removed from forums/yahoo because i mentioned Tienanmen square as response towards criticism of the US. The trick is to take the sites that they do have access to, and subtly flood them with information that the Chinese government hates. The Chinese government will then be forced to spend the money and take the time to censor the sites in china. This becomes a huge inconvenience on everyone because it interferes with their daily lives, and affects commerce.

    remember, the Chinese government spends more money on censorship then it does on its military. Any effort to force them to spend more money will be devastating for them.
    • Like Like x 1

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