Discussion in 'News and Current Events' started by Anonymous, Feb 26, 2011.
We are the ones shaped like a boot right ?
Still down & counting, Someone really needs to report this!
Who should we notify? The Tea Baggers are probably not very happy but I guess they can always watch Fox News for their marching orders & talking points.
I did, I don't agree with it. It is speaking about the amount of money coming from the fund but that isn't their entire retirement, in some states and I don't know if WI is one of them, teachers don't pay S.S. this 5% is not always going to be enough to cover their retirement and will require many of them to be further assisted by the state after retirement. Yes I know the Huffington post says teachers pay SS. But states like Texas have TRS (teachers retirement system) and teachers there don't pay into S.S. But even if that poster was correct it didn't address the issue just called b.s. and apparently that poster believes the state is a corporation as well.
I am looking at the BIG picture. There are few public sector unions left because corporations have been sucessfull having their Repub buds pass legislation and moving jobs overseas where they don't have to worry about being fined for polluting the environment and paying more than slave wages.
THAT IS BECAUSE THEY ARE IN A UNION, DIPSHIT.
Without a union, they would have less say in their job and pay.
They have already taken several paycuts, btw and have accepted the current one Walker tried to ram through. But they don't want to lose the option to collectively bargain AND also, perhaps, they think the part of the bill that will allow Walker to sell public utilities, PAID FOR BY TAXPAYERS, in no bid contracts to companies as yet un-names *cough* KOCH *cough*. When public utilities cecome private (and therefore for profit), servics go down and bills for users go up. What a scam.
Man o Man have you been drinking the Texas tea party kool aid or what? States do not have the power to exempt certain workers from a FEDERAL mandate. That's right--a federal mandate which says that all earners (even those who are self-employed) are to pay into the SS fund.
Fail thread of fail is fail.
Anti-government rhetoric is demagoguery and distraction. Governments are not inherently evil or suppressive. Every relationship is a trade-off between personal liberty and personal sacrifice for the sake of the relationship.
I want the multibillionaires playing games and manipulating news media exposed and stopped.
Police won't boot protesters from Wisconsin Capitol
All governments I've ever heard of have ended by being suppressive. It is in the nature of the beast that our guarantor of our rights is also the biggest violator of our rights. It is not through evil that they become this way. It is because it is the nature of man to take as much as he can for himself. But when the restraints on government are weak then the government will step into the vacuum.
Any group that has a gun as their ultimate argument is dangerous. It doesn't mean they are bad, any more than a car or a gun is inherently bad, but it does mean we need to be very careful how we use such a dangerous tool.
When has it ever not been?
As you said adhocrat, it's not that government is inherently evil. It's human nature to go a little Tom Cruise crazy if given mega-wealth and power. There's just something about a few billion in the bank that makes humans want to postulate new and better realities, using the Law of Attraction to manifest at-cause-ness over MEST.
A better world might need PR help, so buying media conglomerates is wise. Science can be a bugger, but enough money will silence the nitpickers and get more woo sympathetic researchers promoted. Expensive, yes. But merely the price of being awesome.
tl;dr: Power corrupts. That's why we like checks and balances.
At least with government I have a right to ask for records and due process. But what right have I to learn more about the Koch brothers?
All the more reason we need to get rid of that silly-assed thing called "corporate personhood."
With a billion in some offshore accounts I don't need a gun cuz I can buy a hitman. And then I can buy another hitman to take out the first, if I want. Or I can buy a broker to do this shit for me.
Or buy an army of mercenaries.
The government has the gun. The Kochs do not, not legally. The government can legally use force, the private company cannot.
Someone should have told Ford's Harvey Bennett years ago.
Here are a few reasons why:
Do you understand that that sort of criminality is exactly why I am a libertarian?
My whole argument is if you take away the government's power to steal from one and give to another, you automatically quit having immoral relationships based on force.
There comes a point when the power differential is so huge that "legal" becomes what the big guy wants.
The whole checks-n-balances things is a recent anomaly in human history. No guarantee it will last.
All systems have those, eventually.
The French Revolution had checks-n-balances.
Fire the cops and the crooks that don't answer to the people become the cops.
That's a mighty big word, "eventually." I reckon you could fit two or three generations in there.
I find it tragic, watching lower middle class Americans voting for politicians who will not serve their economic interests. How is this possible?
Well, there is an instinct in the human heart stronger than self-interest, and that is spite. You can entice voters to betray their own best interests by provoking resentment at others taking more than their fair share from the community chest.
We should teach fifth graders about this little trick so maybe they don't fall for it later when they're all grown up.
Not really. But you can fit two or three BFGs....
I don't follow your logic...
I hope the person of the year for 2011 will be "The People". It's already looking good for this in many places in the Middle East and Wisconsin, but it needs to happen to many many more places.
No, it can happen over a couple of weeks.
It doesn't take that much to flip people who believe in a system that gives everyone a fair shake to angry people who want to eat the rich that are gaming the system.
Agree completely, and I've wondered the same thing about people who willingly give their lives and treasure to the Cult, which serves none of their interests.
Magnanimous is an organization of like-minded people who...oh, nvmd...
It is the sacred right of every one to minimize their taxes. Don't object to people or companies doing what is in their best interest, complain instead about a government that sets up such an absurd system.
Right. It's the American way: Defend your own farm with your rifle and put out the fire in your barn yourself.
Personally, I'm all for getting rid of the Income Tax entirely and going back to trade tariffs, myself, but that's just me.
Seriously? It seems pretty obvious to me. The biggest monkey gets the best bananas. Might makes right. That's the natural way of things.
If you want something better than the law of the jungle, you need to create an entity that will always be stronger than the biggest monkey. That entity might be called, "the police" or "the government" or "the rule of law." The key thing is, it must be stronger than any other entity present, including the Kochs.
lex talionis. I agree, there needs to be a System that allows people to do whatever they want with the least interference. What we have is government by whim.
But can you envision a system that is completely private and voluntary, not based on force? That's what i want.
And I am not saying get rid of government, I am saying it is a dangerous weapon and we need to keep it in our sights at all times.
What is this US-centric political faggotry?
I'm not sure you're following the conversation. I made the point that our system of political checks and balances is a relatively new phenomenon in human history. "Might makes right" has been a far more common system for settling arguments.
Our world of regulated free markets and representative government might one day regress to something more akin to feudalism or fascism. And, although natural forces might favor the re-emergence of democracy "eventually,' there's no reason to think that "eventually" might mean anything convenient to me or you.
Your saying "it can happen over a couple of weeks," isn't particularly comforting.
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