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Anon hypocrits to support Sen Xen's call for CoS to agree to inquiry

Discussion in 'Senator Xenophon And Scientology' started by Anonymous, Feb 5, 2010.

  1. Anonymous Member

    Anon hypocrits to support Sen Xen's call for CoS to agree to inquiry

    Kind of hypocritical of us to both hide our own identities and ask that Scientology voluntarily submit to an investigation.

    just sayin...
  2. grebe Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Fail. We don't do fair game.
  3. Sponge Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Who's "us"?
  4. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    I'm just saying that we can't ourselves make the argument "if you have nothing to hide, hide nothing."

    Which is why we have to be eternally grateful to our good buddy Senator Xenuphone.
  5. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Don't fall into scientology's diversionary trap. It's not about anonymous, with or without a capital "A". They would love for the focus to be taken off them.

    Quoted again:
  6. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Rubbish. If I'd done nothing wrong I'd be happy to have law enforcement investigate (and vindicate) me. In fact, I have given my name to the FBI when I made contact with them about false bomb threat allegations made against Anon, precisely because I'm not afraid to be investigated. I'm Anonymous to the CoS because they represent injustice and cannot be trusted.
  7. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    And yet you posted anonymously.
  8. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    No I didn't.
  9. grumpus Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    That's incorrect, and you're an idiot. Just sayin'.

    (Welcome back from your ban.)
  10. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    What's wrong with you? What part of "CoS ... they represent injustice and cannot be trusted" didn't you understand genius?
  11. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    There's a big difference between hiding your identity to someone you know could cause you trouble and welcoming a police investiagtion of the activities that you do.

    And there's a huge difference between choosing to leave out your internet nick in a post and welcoming a police investigation of the activities that you do. There's nothing hypocritical about the situation.

    As a side note, Anonymous doesn't even have to "welcome" investigations. The police could pop in here any second and see what we do here without us knowing. Hell, as far as you know, I could be an FBI agent.
  12. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    That is not a crime. I see anonymous people everyday in the street. They don't wear name badges.
    Stay on target.
  13. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Hippocrates2.jpg
  14. Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry


    Im with you on that. I cant even understand half the language.

    Only interested in bringing down the cult (at this stage). And I am against the Australian Government brilliant idea of these internet filters but I suspect there are better ways of getting the message across than bringing down the PM's website.
  15. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    [IMG]
  16. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    ^ Completely agree and I, too, made contact with the FBI for the false bomb threat allegations made against Anon. Even if I wasn't anonymous to CoS ijn real life doesn't mean I need to use my nick or my RL name on here.
  17. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    I didn't mean to say that we shouldn't be hiding our identities. I merely meant to say that anonymous can't make that argument ourselves.

    A government investigation of scientology means making scientology's secrets public record. Would you submit to make your secrets public record? I expect any yes replies to include your name and social security number.

    Don't even try to argue that the difference is that they are evil and we are not. To people who don't know this for a fact, for instance most of the Australian Senate, that argument is hearsay.
  18. grumpus Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    You've trolled your fallacious non-point into the ground.

    Co$ is an organized crime syndicate disguised as a Corporate Church. The Co$ is the subject here. Individual Anons are not at issue.

    An Australian Senator is acting upon MOUNTAINS of facts and testimony in order to investigate an organization that has sixty years of evidence piled up against it as being fraudulent and worse.

    You attempt to compare this to an individual Anon being willing to expose his personal identification for no reason. Tell me, Mr. Halfassed Advocate, just what are the charges against the hypothetical Anon you'd like to make this about?

    If you show me an Anon who has the decades-long record of legal abuses that Co$ has, including extortion and blackmail and mass infiltration of the US Government, I will join you in asking that Anon to submit to an investigation by the Australian Senate when asked by the Australian Senate to do so.

    Until then, STFU or learn to be a serious Devil's Advocate.
  19. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    The difference is that it is an organization acting according to policies working against public interests. When Scientology's secret Operation Snow White was uncovered, along with all other "Ops," it was of highly public interest that these secrets become public. My name and social security number is of no public interest. Can't believe I have to explain the obvious.
  20. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Well I'm not going to let just ANYONE investigate me!
  21. Hombre Moderator Skandinaviska

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Well, if there was a similar level of witnesses and documents that lead to me and the government wanted to investigate, then I suppose I would give them my name and social security number.

    But then again, if there was such a level of witnesses and documents against me i doubt they wouldn't know who I was in the first place.

    But that's just me.
  22. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Lol. "most of the Australian Senate" isn't going to be persuaded by Anon anyway. What we say is immaterial.
  23. TinyDancer Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Your ideas intrigue me. I'd like to subscribe to your newsletter.
  24. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Not an issue to us who know it is not an issue.

    Indeed he is, but if the evidence he provided was enough for the senate as a whole to force an investigation, they would have already. As it is, he is requesting that Scientology voluntarily submit to an investigation. While I think this is absolutely the correct next step for him to make, we as anons should be silent on whether or not they choose to do this lest we be prepared submit to hold ourselves to the same standard and voluntarily submit our information to the public. Is that so hard to understand?
  25. Hombre Moderator Skandinaviska

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    ^ What's "our information"?

    All info on this site can be viewed by the public. We don't hold any seekrit dox that nobody else has.
  26. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    You are equating people's personal information with corporate Scientology's internal policies, which are immutable "Scripture"?
  27. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Why not? We hold our identities sacred and would not submit our personal information to anyone unless compelled to do so; they hold their internal policies and writings as sacred and would not submit them to anyone unless compelled to do so.

    To an outsider, what is the difference other than we claim that we are right and they are wrong?
  28. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    What's your name?
  29. Mutante Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Sure is Zalgo ITT.
  30. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    If you had been watching a little more closely, you'd have noticed that Hombre actually gave his name to the Board of Supervisors of Riverside County in June 2009.

    You picked the wrong target.
  31. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Doesn't change the fact that Xenophon asked the CoS to voluntarily submit to the investigation.
  32. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    I guess I should have said "What's my name?"
  33. grumpus Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    No, it isn't hard to understand, it's just fallacious. Again, I ask you - which Anon is being asked by an Australian Senator to submit to an investigation? You are using a hypothetical question vs. a real one without even having defined the parameters of your hypothetical.

    You have offered no WHY for an Anon to "submit" or shown that there's any standard other than the one in question - a request by an Australian Senator.

    So again - show me the Anon who is being requested to submit to this investigation, and show me the evidence against said Anon that equates to the evidence against Co$. Until you do that, your comparison is invalid.

    And if you ask me, your comparison is intentionally invalid.

    And to point to the biggest fallacy: you charge hypocrisy. The answer to that is easy: Even if it's true, so what? Hypocrisy has nothing to do with the validity of one's claims. If a thief says it's wrong to steal, is he wrong because he's a hypocrite? No.

    The charge of hypocrisy is a dodge. It's a back-handed ad hominem attack that evades the charges made by the alleged hypocrite.

    Edit: Also,

    <3
  34. TinyDancer Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    I was correcting your assertion that if the evidence was there, the Senate would have voted for an inquiry already. False.
  35. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    The "devli's advocates" are becoming worse and of a lower apparent IQ by the minute here. Is it due to alcohol or desperation?
  36. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    It doesn't matter if it's a senator, and it doesn't matter how much evidence he has. It is a matter of making secrets public regardless of what part of the public is asking. To the public at large, the evidence Xenophon has is merely allegations. We, also, are alleged to have, as an example from this very thread, illegally attacked the Ausie prime minister's website, among a billions other things. Would you volunteer your ISP logs to prove otherwise without legal compulsion? Are you saying just because he's a senator that his non legally binding requests are any different from the non legally binding requests of the CoS?

    That is a defensible position, though I never said the claims Xenophon made were wrong. It's not like this is the first time anonymous has used legal, albeit self-serving means to an altruistic goal.
  37. grumpus Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    And here your crux falls apart again. The allegations are BASED on evidence. Are you actually going to pretend ignorance of all the on-paper court cases and eyewitness testimony Xenophon has access to?

    And who is "the public at large" whose perceptions you speak for? And why would that matter?

    You still offer no evidence against any hypothetical Anon for your hypothetical investigation to which they should "submit."

    Instead, you ask me if I would submit to some investigation against me that does not exist. "Anonymous" is not a legal entity. Individual people are, and Co$ is. If some individual is guilty of something having to do with hax0ring, that is an entirely separate issue for that individual. It has nothing to do with me or any other individual.

    When I am confronted with a request by a public official for records involving some investigation, I'll be able to answer you.

    You still have no claim except that of hypocrisy, which is not only fallacious, it doesn't even apply to this situation.
  38. anonsoldier Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Would I volunteer my ISP logs? To an entity of the legal system, sure. I've done nothing wrong. Which is mainly why no one is asking or trying to compel me to volunteer my ISP logs.

    Yes, a senator going "I really want to know what's going on" is extremely different from some non-governmental organization going "I really want to know what's going on". It is his job as a public servant to be informed of and take action on matters relating to the public's interest. I think it has been well established from the docs, testimonials, criminal records, court records, historical data, etc that what Scientology does behind closed doors is relevant to the public's interest.

    You know what the difference between allegations and facts is? A court of law or an appointed investigation. That's it. Nothing else.

    A person is alleged to have hit someone until a court of law goes "You hit someone". Then its a fact.

    A bureaucrat is alleged to have committed acts of fraud until some governmental inquiry goes "You committed fraud". Then its a fact.

    So, since we really want to know if these allegations are facts or falsehoods...they should probably be examined in a court of law, or some kind of public inquiry. Sounds like a plan, who's with me???????

    </Channeling of Dr. Cox>
  39. Anonymous Member

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    yay grumpy ITT
  40. Hombre Moderator Skandinaviska

    Re: Xenophon challenges CoS to agree to senate inquiry

    Since when is that relevant to find out if there are any cyber-hate-crimes going on among protestors?

    Last time I checked, Xenophon wasn't asking CoS to hand over a member list, but be open to the police doing their investigation.

    Should the same be proposed to me and I was indeed innocent, I'd say "go for it, Senator". All I'd have to do is... well, nothing.

    Of course, had the senator asked for a member list of every person in CoS, then I would've agreed with you that it may be hypocritical of us to encourage CoS to do so. But I wouldn't be in favor of that any way, because it's irrelevant to the investigation.

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